After a futile 4-month job hunt, I have decided to return to school at 42

[Kimochi]

On 9/20/2020 at 10:16 AM, Guest guest said:

A guy who is in his 40s, single and gym regularly, and have a gym bod, equal to gay? Lucky i do not gym, do not have gym bod, maybe this is the reason no one suspect i am gay even i am single and 40s! Haha.

Congratulation...  You worsened yourself.. 

[Guest Funny]

51 minutes ago, singalion said:

Even if he is gay, so what? It is his decision to be openly gay or not.

And for an interview at the local mainstream media, would you disclose you are gay???

 

 

You don't have to be so "straight".

 

This is what a gay forum is for. Discuss gay issues. Make a guess. Use our gaydar. Gossip, Formed our own conclusion and then shared our view among the gay.  Harmless and fun. 

[Guest Yummy]

He looks yummy, I will bed him anytime 

[Guest hehehehe]

44 minutes ago, Guest Yummy said:

He looks yummy, I will bed him anytime 

Beauty in the eyes of the beholder.  It is a weird world.  I don't find him appealing to me though.

[Guest guest]

10 hours ago, Kimochi said:

Congratulation...  You worsened yourself.. 

Why worsened?

[Guest Liam]

I would have applauded your move under normal circumstances.

 

Now with Covid, the lecturers will be thanking their lucky stars that you are keeping them gainfully employed. 

 

Might want to consider keeping your money to yourself as jobs will  be even more difficult to come by. 

[Guest Cheapo Bosses]

On 9/16/2020 at 6:45 PM, Guest Experienced. said:

Through my years of working in different MNC.  I noticed it is the Local that impart knowledge to foreigners.  Then these foreigners quitted and used the knowledge they learned, from the local, to apply for jobs and compete with the local.  Here is how it went.

 

1)  These foreigners came into Singapore, fresh, unable to cope in the multicultural Singapore.

2)  They forced themself to blend in, but with pampered mentality that they cannot eat these, cannot do that due to their lifestyle and culture

3)  Then the local tried to blend into the foreigner, in the hope to make the new comers felt at home.

4)  Went it come to work, the foreigners do not understand the local requirements, laws, governance..etc.  Their countries are flexible but not in Singapore.

5)  Then the local taught them many things the foreigners are required to know to help him/her get a head-start in the working world here

6). Then after  a year, the foreigners felt more comfortable and confident to look for next higher pay job and quitted.

7)  In their next job, they interviewed their own kind and bring them into Singapore, especially after these foreigners were offered "PR" status and eventually the govt

     send them an invitation to become Citizen

 

'8) These foreigners then bring in their wife, and then a whole village of families to find opportunity here and taught them how to exploit the system.

 

The tumor spread from one to another and today, this country is incurable that the Labour Union, the ministers and MP have to admit that the system needs to be tweaked to favour the local and build a Singapore core.  Unfortunately,  those were mere rhetorics.  While many countries noticed the danger of saturation of foreigners in their work place, Singapore still welcomed them at the expense of the local talent.

 

The above is my personal experiences for the last decade.

Last time I woked overseas, my employer wanted me to train my replacement. What I did was to introduce  him to the various personnel and their roles. But I never taught him anything. The fellow realised and just kept quiet.

 

I mean I came to the job with my own skills gained by me and I refuse to transfer these skill sets. The company can replace me with someone cheaper and they get the person they deserve.

 

What you staed are initiatd by the govt. Locals might not have a choice.

[Guest Cheapo Bosses]

Dear James

 

Take note, empployers prefer to hire foreigners

 

1) Who can't speak England oops English.

2) Dubious qualifications. Eg degree mills. 6 months post grad diploma.

3) People whose qualifications aren't from Commonwealth unis.

4) Some more you got to report to higher ups who are lesser qualified. 

 

All thes because our govt have to fulfill the CECA and other  FTAs.

[fetish72]

Congratulation to you i hope you doing well in your studies as well your health. Pray that you will pass out with  flying color. Age is just a number everything is you yourself which path you heading to.

[Guest Numbering is Real]

4 hours ago, fetish72 said:

 Age is just a number 

In reality, the boss will count that age number for you and decide if they wanted you. Period.

[tyan]

After coming to 7 months without job, I am still hopeful that I will find a job soon. And I am 45 this year. Mid-career. 

[Guest Ask for your IC]

19 hours ago, Guest Numbering is Real said:

In reality, the boss will count that age number for you and decide if they wanted you. Period.

HR asks for your IC is to check your age. Age is just a number but it’s reflected in your IC

[Brian37]

2 hours ago, tyan said:

After coming to 7 months without job, I am still hopeful that I will find a job soon. And I am 45 this year. Mid-career. 

Jia you

[Guest Mid-career Job Seeker]

For the past months, I did received calls and text messages from prospective employers. Things went well until when they asked for your age or DOB..

 

One was straightforward and told me the company is looking for someone younger (so much for Fair Employment Practices).

 

Another sounded surprise and asked me to repeat my age again.. then say they are reviewing candidates and went silent thereafter. 
 

Others “disappeared”, even I followed up with text messages and emails on my job application status.

 

It is a cruel job market for older workers, like it or not. The lucky ones will get something suitable, most will have to adjust their expectations and prepare to do a more junior, or entry level role. Otherwise remain jobless for awhile.. or longer. 
 

That is a fact of life now. 

[mate69]

Damn sad

[fab]

2 hours ago, Guest Mid-career Job Seeker said:

For the past months, I did received calls and text messages from prospective employers. Things went well until when they asked for your age or DOB..

 

One was straightforward and told me the company is looking for someone younger (so much for Fair Employment Practices).

 

Another sounded surprise and asked me to repeat my age again.. then say they are reviewing candidates and went silent thereafter. 
 

Others “disappeared”, even I followed up with text messages and emails on my job application status.

 

It is a cruel job market for older workers, like it or not. The lucky ones will get something suitable, most will have to adjust their expectations and prepare to do a more junior, or entry level role. Otherwise remain jobless for awhile.. or longer. 
 

That is a fact of life now. 

 

R u 40s n above?

[Guest guest]

8 hours ago, tyan said:

After coming to 7 months without job, I am still hopeful that I will find a job soon. And I am 45 this year. Mid-career. 

You quit without a job 7 months ago or got retrenched? When you are in your 40s, not easy to find another job which would have the same salary as you were drawing or even higher salary. Unless the company is looking for a senior position or managerial role.

[tyan]

3 hours ago, fab said:

 

R u 40s n above?

Yes. 45. 

[tyan]

34 minutes ago, Guest guest said:

You quit without a job 7 months ago or got retrenched? When you are in your 40s, not easy to find another job which would have the same salary as you were drawing or even higher salary. Unless the company is looking for a senior position or managerial role.

Yes. Hope to get a senior position. But mostly get back to me are junior role. Not sure if they can pay. 

Edited October 4, 2020 by tyan

[Steve5380]

I would not discourage anyone from returning to school at 42 to enhance the education.  By then, one should have sufficient experience to know what one is passionate about.  And THIS,  more than money,  should decide the subject of study to undertake.  This should be seen as THE ONE opportunity to satisfy one's purpose in life.  The goal may not need to be a college or graduate degree.  It may be simply the study of a skill necessary to perform in a desired position.

 

I have been blessed by having a strong interest in science, technology, computer hardware, software, algorithms. I was an engineering manager at my company when a new field opened up involving fiber optics.  I was 40 y.o. and I decided to attend a local university towards getting a PhD in electrical engineering, in the field of electro-optics.  For four years I went to evening and night classes after work, the fifth year I got a payed leave of absence from work to attend the university full time  (a requirement for the PhD). Then I graduated, big satisfaction, elation.  But by then that new field at work involving fiber optics had been abandoned, and I was never able to apply my newly acquired knowledge.  I got some recognition, but no promotion. I didn't mind, since I continued working on other interesting projects.  But the experience of having to produce a dissertation and become an expert in a few short years has served me well since then. 

 

Another experience:  My wife at the time, also around 40 y.o., decided to fulfill the strong vocation of her life and become a registered nurse. She went to the best nursing school in Houston, and in 4 years she graduated with honors.  From there she changed from home wife to nurse in a hospital, and with time she became the head nurse in a neonatal ward, position she held for many decades.  This may also have encouraged my son to pursue medical school.

 

At an age like 40 y.o. one may discover new areas of interest, never considered before.  If I had not been successful in engineering I would have pursued a new career as a doctor. I find this field superior to engineering because it adds the contact with people to the technicalities of medicine.  I would also have chosen a new career as a lawyer ( since I have discovered that I like to debate, argue ,  )

.

 

 

Edited October 4, 2020 by Steve5380

[sgmaven]

2 hours ago, Steve5380 said:

I would not discourage anyone from returning to school at 42 to enhance the education.

I do agree that one should not attach an expiry date for themselves with regard to further education. Myself, I did my MBA at age 40, and a postgrad cert in IP Law in my mid-40s.

 

That said, it should be more about self-actualisation and self-improvement, rather than with the only of objective of getting a job or earning a promotion.

 

Let's be honest, in spite of the fact that you are only at the mid-point of your career at 40, most employers would not want to accept you in a job without prior experience (minus a few fields that are more open, due to special circumstances).

 

I would admit that I did my MBA without doing enough background research on what was happening to the MBA market at that time. But do realise that much of the value of the MBA is related to the network you build while at school. Both your current cohort, as well as the strength of the alumni network. What you actually learn during the course, you could probably learn at a fraction of the cost. That is how schools like INSEAD and Chicago GSB can charge an arm and a leg for their courses.

 

As for returning to the job market, post-MBA, I think most Singaporean employers do not actually pay you any extra for having an MBA. Financial literacy, including basic financial models, and understanding various concepts in business strategy and marketing, are more or less expected, if you are going to advance to senior management.

 

If you are already around 40, and still have no idea about finance, etc. Perhaps taking these subjects up may be helpful, but don't expect doors to open, just because you have an MBA.

[Guest Fatty]

On 9/22/2020 at 3:37 PM, Guest Yummy said:

He looks yummy, I will bed him anytime 

The photo was heavily touched up

[mate69]

7 hours ago, sgmaven said:

I do agree that one should not attach an expiry date for themselves with regard to further education. Myself, I did my MBA at age 40, and a postgrad cert in IP Law in my mid-40s.

 

That said, it should be more about self-actualisation and self-improvement, rather than with the only of objective of getting a job or earning a promotion.

 

Let's be honest, in spite of the fact that you are only at the mid-point of your career at 40, most employers would not want to accept you in a job without prior experience (minus a few fields that are more open, due to special circumstances).

 

I would admit that I did my MBA without doing enough background research on what was happening to the MBA market at that time. But do realise that much of the value of the MBA is related to the network you build while at school. Both your current cohort, as well as the strength of the alumni network. What you actually learn during the course, you could probably learn at a fraction of the cost. That is how schools like INSEAD and Chicago GSB can charge an arm and a leg for their courses.

 

As for returning to the job market, post-MBA, I think most Singaporean employers do not actually pay you any extra for having an MBA. Financial literacy, including basic financial models, and understanding various concepts in business strategy and marketing, are more or less expected, if you are going to advance to senior management.

 

If you are already around 40, and still have no idea about finance, etc. Perhaps taking these subjects up may be helpful, but don't expect doors to open, just because you have an MBA.

 

Couldn't have said it any better! 

[Guest Guest]

7 hours ago, sgmaven said:

I do agree that one should not attach an expiry date for themselves with regard to further education. Myself, I did my MBA at age 40, and a postgrad cert in IP Law in my mid-40s.

 

That said, it should be more about self-actualisation and self-improvement, rather than with the only of objective of getting a job or earning a promotion.

 

Let's be honest, in spite of the fact that you are only at the mid-point of your career at 40, most employers would not want to accept you in a job without prior experience (minus a few fields that are more open, due to special circumstances).

 

I would admit that I did my MBA without doing enough background research on what was happening to the MBA market at that time. But do realise that much of the value of the MBA is related to the network you build while at school. Both your current cohort, as well as the strength of the alumni network. What you actually learn during the course, you could probably learn at a fraction of the cost. That is how schools like INSEAD and Chicago GSB can charge an arm and a leg for their courses.

 

As for returning to the job market, post-MBA, I think most Singaporean employers do not actually pay you any extra for having an MBA. Financial literacy, including basic financial models, and understanding various concepts in business strategy and marketing, are more or less expected, if you are going to advance to senior management.

 

If you are already around 40, and still have no idea about finance, etc. Perhaps taking these subjects up may be helpful, but don't expect doors to open, just because you have an MBA.

 

Long story short: Getting any good degrees will not land you any jobs to help you put food on the table here in Singapore. The degree's all about "self-actualisation and self-improvement".

 

So just go India and buy a degree for yourself. It will save you the time to study, and in the meanwhile you can do a job search. 

[Guest Mid-career Job Seeker]

Further to my previoys posting... 
 

I also contacted a Career Coach from e2i. She advised me to touchup and make improvements to my CV, which I did.

 

She did refer an entry-level position to me, which again no to avail after the prospective employer found out my age. Occasional emails from her asking how is my job search but not much assistance. 

 

The worse is Employment Agencies; few contacted me and again went silent after a few phone questionings. 

While I am not a pessimistic person, I really feel the hardship of finding a job at my age, despite my rich experience and a degree holder. 

 

[Guest Been There]

21 minutes ago, Guest Mid-career Job Seeker said:

Occasional emails from her asking how is my job search but not much assistance. 

 

The worse is Employment Agencies; few contacted me and again went silent after a few phone questionings. 

While I am not a pessimistic person, I really feel the hardship of finding a job at my age, despite my rich experience and a degree holder. 

 

Highlighted in RED, Rely on yourself, you can forget about the CRAP of these people existence, equivallent to a junk yard They live on commission,  non-professional and took up this dying trade as last resort when life fails them.  They will not hesitate to cheat, lie and live their life entertained by unemployed job seekers to make them feel better than the rest.  Trust me, you wouldn't wouldn't want to go that route to make you feel like you digging into a deeper grave.  Whether you are currently seeking jobs, or not, try and go beyond those standard and confidently believe you can achieve greater things without being put down by low life "career coach".   

[sgmaven]

59 minutes ago, Guest Guest said:

Long story short: Getting any good degrees will not land you any jobs to help you put food on the table here in Singapore. The degree's all about "self-actualisation and self-improvement".

I never said that good degrees will not land you any job, just that one should moderate one's expectations. I also stressed the importance of the network at the institution (both the cohort and the alumni). I wonder what you consider a good degree? A good MBA would be one from the likes of Harvard or MIT from the US, or LBS from the UK.

 

1 hour ago, Guest Guest said:

So just go India and buy a degree for yourself. It will save you the time to study, and in the meanwhile you can do a job search. 

Fancy this kind of advice, buying a fake qualification!

[sgmaven]

43 minutes ago, Guest Mid-career Job Seeker said:

Ialso contacted a Career Coach from e2i. She advised me to touchup and make improvements to my CV, which I did

I agree that e2i are a waste of time...

 

45 minutes ago, Guest Mid-career Job Seeker said:

The worse is Employment Agencies; few contacted me and again went silent after a few phone questionings.

It really depends on the Employment Agency. Do not look for those who are mass-market employment agencies. Most of them target fresh grads and link them up with entry-level jobs, and are not suited for mid-career professionals.

 

48 minutes ago, Guest Mid-career Job Seeker said:

While I am not a pessimistic person, I really feel the hardship of finding a job at my age, despite my rich experience and a degree holder. 

 

Look at how you are crafting your CV, if you really have rich experience. By rich experience, I hope you don't mean a track record of job-hops or not doing a particular field for more than 2 years. As for being a degree-holder, it is almost a given in this day and age, so one shouldn't expect anything special. I used to joke that Masters are now so common, that they don't offer much value in terms of better compensation.

 

All the best for your job hunt!

[sgmaven]

If you think that cheap foreign labour only affects Singapore, think again. It is an issue found in most developed economies.

 

If you expect to have a cushy life, once you get a degree, without the need for any upskilling, then you are not much better than the US citizens who think that they can have a middle-class lifestyle with just a highschool diploma.

 

Don't expect your employer to help you to upgrade, or pay for your courses. Instead, do your own research and find the courses and training that is most suitable for you.

[Guest Crappy]

39 minutes ago, sgmaven said:

Don't expect your employer to help you to upgrade, or pay for your courses. Instead, do your own research and find the courses and training that is most suitable for you.

"Suitable" and "Passionate" are very different thing.  Think carefully before you use your skillfuture credit.  Avoid courses conducted by PA or anyone associated with PA at all cost. Those are really crappy to enrich the cronies.

[Guest Guest]

4 hours ago, sgmaven said:

If you think that cheap foreign labour only affects Singapore, think again. It is an issue found in most developed economies

 

How many "developed" countries allow almost the foreign population increase to get to almost 50% of the entire population? 

 

4 hours ago, sgmaven said:

If you expect to have a cushy life, once you get a degree, without the need for any upskilling, then you are not much better than the US citizens who think that they can have a middle-class lifestyle with just a highschool diploma.

 

"Upgrading"? Lol! That's one word which has been abused way too often. The moment you upgrade yourself, you'd be "over qualified" for the job. 

[Guest Mid-career Job Seeker]

There is huge propaganda on assistance from career coach for job seekers. They are really a waste of time, those who have been through this will likely agree with me. The one whom I spoke to has no depth, and I believe she provides model template advise to everyone. 
 

Indeed the Employment Agencies favor younger candidates as the success rate for placing them is higher, as companies prefer to hire younger. It is afterall commission base assignments for them, and helping (mature) job seekers to secure a job is not their priority. 
 

Few of my Singaporean friends attended interviews conducted by hiring managers who are foreigners. Such an irony... whose the host now?? 

 

[Guest Lesson to be learned]

18 minutes ago, Guest Mid-career Job Seeker said:

Few of my Singaporean friends attended interviews conducted by hiring managers who are foreigners. Such an irony... whose the host now?? 

 

It won't take long. Unless the govt prepare to lost more GRCs in 4 years time.

[Guest Guest]

24 minutes ago, Guest Mid-career Job Seeker said:

There is huge propaganda on assistance from career coach for job seekers. They are really a waste of time, those who have been through this will likely agree with me. The one whom I spoke to has no depth, and I believe she provides model template advise to everyone. 
 

Indeed the Employment Agencies favor younger candidates as the success rate for placing them is higher, as companies prefer to hire younger. It is afterall commission base assignments for them, and helping (mature) job seekers to secure a job is not their priority. 
 

Few of my Singaporean friends attended interviews conducted by hiring managers who are foreigners. Such an irony... whose the host now?? 

 

This entire situation has been happening more than a decade ago, even before GE 2011. Remember "Jobs for FTs, NS for Singaporeans"? And yet, by sitting on the issue for so many years, it is the government's implicit and explicit consent to sideline the local workforce. And even right now, our ministers are still treating trash to be talents. Why? Just because a few talents came in the past, so they open the floodgates to all the rest of the trash that flooded in as well. There's no filtration system in place, as we can see from all those fake degrees and unqualified workforce. The damage has long been done, and is still going on. There's no way to put Humpty Dumpty together ever again, no matter what we do now. Whatever that was created by LKY, is going to be completely destroyed by the son very soon, if not already so. 

 

Who did you vote for in 2011, 2015 and 2020?

[Guest guest]

22 hours ago, tyan said:

Yes. Hope to get a senior position. But mostly get back to me are junior role. Not sure if they can pay. 

Before waiting for that opportunity to come, you should find a temp job now rather than out of job. If you still expect for a high pay and do not lower your expectation, you might ended up out of job for a long time.

[Guest guest]

1 hour ago, Guest Mid-career Job Seeker said:

There is huge propaganda on assistance from career coach for job seekers. They are really a waste of time, those who have been through this will likely agree with me. The one whom I spoke to has no depth, and I believe she provides model template advise to everyone. 
 

Indeed the Employment Agencies favor younger candidates as the success rate for placing them is higher, as companies prefer to hire younger. It is afterall commission base assignments for them, and helping (mature) job seekers to secure a job is not their priority. 
 

Few of my Singaporean friends attended interviews conducted by hiring managers who are foreigners. Such an irony... whose the host now?? 

 

I think it have been long time many companies hiring managers and HR are foreigners. I don't know why it is so easy for foreigners to become HR in sg?

[sgmaven]

1 hour ago, Guest guest said:

I think it have been long time many companies hiring managers and HR are foreigners. I don't know why it is so easy for foreigners to become HR in sg?

Frankly, HR wasn't taught in the universities in Singapore until very much later on. Hence, there are very few qualified Singaporean HR specialists. I always joke that most HR in Singapore are just personnel admin, and not HR.

 

Perhaps this is the reason why many MNCs have justified the use of foreigners to helm regional HR.

 

This has been my experience with HR, both in MNCs and local firms. Most of the locals doing HR really leave much to be desired. And foreigners can sometimes do a better job, unfortunately.

[sgmaven]

3 hours ago, Guest Guest said:

How many "developed" countries allow almost the foreign population increase to get to almost 50% of the entire population?

Take a look at other micro-states or city states. Many of them face similar issues. Not saying whether it is right or wrong, but Singapore is not unique in this regard.

[sgmaven]

2 hours ago, Guest Mid-career Job Seeker said:

There is huge propaganda on assistance from career coach for job seekers. They are really a waste of time, those who have been through this will likely agree with me. The one whom I spoke to has no depth, and I believe she provides model template advise to everyone.

I do agree that many of the career coaches do precious little, especially those appointed by the government to help with job searches. That said, you get what you pay for (一分錢，一分貨). The services of specialist career coaching from good firms can help people refocus on what they can do, and polish up their CVs, even help them with interview practice.

 

2 hours ago, Guest Mid-career Job Seeker said:

Indeed the Employment Agencies favor younger candidates as the success rate for placing them is higher, as companies prefer to hire younger. It is afterall commission base assignments for them, and helping (mature) job seekers to secure a job is not their priority.

This is probably because you are looking at the generalist Employment Agencies. The more bespoke firms are much better, and do much more, but these tend to focus on candidates with annual packages of at least $250k. While they are still motivated by commissions, they do take a longer term view, since vacancies at that level tend to be more selectively filled.

[Guest harping wrong song]

3 hours ago, Guest Guest said:

 

How many "developed" countries allow almost the foreign population increase to get to almost 50% of the entire population? 

 

 

"Upgrading"? Lol! That's one word which has been abused way too often. The moment you upgrade yourself, you'd be "over qualified" for the job. 

 

2 hours ago, Guest Guest said:

 

This entire situation has been happening more than a decade ago, even before GE 2011. Remember "Jobs for FTs, NS for Singaporeans"? And yet, by sitting on the issue for so many years, it is the government's implicit and explicit consent to sideline the local workforce. And even right now, our ministers are still treating trash to be talents. Why? Just because a few talents came in the past, so they open the floodgates to all the rest of the trash that flooded in as well. There's no filtration system in place, as we can see from all those fake degrees and unqualified workforce. The damage has long been done, and is still going on. There's no way to put Humpty Dumpty together ever again, no matter what we do now. Whatever that was created by LKY, is going to be completely destroyed by the son very soon, if not already so. 

 

Who did you vote for in 2011, 2015 and 2020?

 

 

Stop painting an untrue picture!

 

Are 1 mil Foreign Workers competing with Singaporeans for jobs?

 

Clear answer : NO!

 

Do Singaporeans want to do these jobs?

 

Clear answer: No!

 

The EP Holders and S Pass Foreigners only amount to 14.5% of the workforce.

 

Someone else said this before exactly at this thread. Numbers openly confirm this.

 

After the 13.5% boom of growth in 2009 the local workforce was too small to cater for the growth in businesses and jobs. This is the reason for growing numbers in the Foreign Workforce and the government having permitted more EP and S Pass holders to work in Singapore. 

Anyway LKY is the mastermind of this policy.

 

What is your intention of repeating this slogan over and over again?

 

If there is no growth and inflowing FDI then there will not be any increase of job opportunities for locals.

 

You just ignore the facts due to your repeated hatred against Foreigners.

 

The amount of EP Holders and S Pass Holders are still at only 14.5% of the total workforce. The amount of these two groups of Foreign Employees were 11.5% in 2009. 

 

You won't win anyone here with your untrue invented anti foreigner slogans.

 

The cause of current job losses are due to the covid-19 crisis and have no other reason.

 

On 9/17/2020 at 8:34 PM, Guest hate instigator said:

 

 

Some guys write here as if the Unemployment Rate in Singapore has reached levels seen in Burkina Faso in Africa ( in that country currently at 77%).

Please don't overdo.

 

It is clearly an untruth to post here (new or existing) jobs in Singapore are meant for Foreigners only.

If this had been the case I just wonder what all these local people do who tell me they go to work? Or do they just leave their house to go to work

to pretend to their relatives they still have a job but in real they don't work?

 

And nobody needs to paint the consequences of a a severe crisis such as Covid-19/ Coronovirus as the end of the world. There had been other crisis in Singapore and the world. Singapore will need some time to adjust and come back to GDP growth and receiving new investments into the country.

Yes, the unemployment rate will increase in the coming months or by mid of next year, when government support will end. But the reason is the collapse of many businesses due to the Covid-19 crisis and nothing else (and for sure the result of any unemployment is not for a Foreigner having taken away the job of the local).

 

If the economy is back on track, the higher amount of unemployed will be absorbed by the market.

I only see problems for the very lowly skilled Singaporeans, but this trend has been ongoing, since Singapore is not much longer involved in low skilled manufacturing or product assembly.

 

Just to get the numbers right again:

Employment Pass Holders in end of 2019 amounted to 193,700  by end of June 2020: 189,700

S-Pass Holders in the end of 2019 amounted to 200,000 by end of June 2020: 188,800

There are around 30,000 work pass holders (who are not foreign domestic workers =maids or construction, shipping etc workers.) and work in business related industries.

The rest of Foreigners working in Singapore are maids and constructions workers or manual workers in other industries (factory, cleaning, marine, refinery, street building, tree pruning...). Yes, the number of these manual Foreign workers is on the higher end.

But, tell me whether any single Singaporean wants to take up the jobs of those manual Foreign workers (Bangla and Indians)?

 

Please stop drawing a picture as if Foreigners under EP and S-Pass pose a serious threat to Singaporeans in the workforce.

 

It is in fact is exactly the other way: Without those EP Pass Holders, many foreign owned MNCs and SMEs would not have set up in Singapore and Singapore would not have creating sufficient jobs for the locals as the local grown industries would not be able to absorb all Singaporean Employees. It is natural for any Foreign owned company to bring their own guys (Foreigners) to Singapore to oversee, direct and manage the local set up of their subsidiaries in Singapore.   Even Singapore companies who invested in overseas countries have posted Singaporeans to their overseas units to manage these companies at the top tier level.   After 30 years when Singapore (a place with no resources) built up a booming business center by attracting Foreign FDI (Direct Investment), who created plenty of jobs here for Singaporeans as one of the most respected sucess stories in the world, you hit out at these Foreign Investors? It is easy for most to look at other countries and opportunities if they sense they are no longer welcome here. (But you would know the result if Foreign companies will shy on Singapore...)   Stop drawing these false pictures and crying foul as if the Singaporean Employees are all the manual workers cleaning void decks and constructing HDBs and industrial buildings and not the foreigners and all Foreigners sitting on the medium to top jobs and punching the labour whip out to the Singaporeans in the lower ships hull.     You are trying to create a myth which holds no value to the truth of the workforce situation in Singapore.   You can stop with your Foreigner bashing and trying to create enmity between Singaporeans and Foreigners.   You are clearly barking up the wrong tree.   Please all Singaporeans who lost your job to any Foreigner come forward and step out of the bush! Where are you???         The most disappointing here is, even after more than 10 hours there is not anyone criticizing on above post.

 

Just to get the numbers right again:

Employment Pass Holders in end of 2019 amounted to 193,700  by end of June 2020: 189,700

S-Pass Holders in the end of 2019 amounted to 200,000 by end of June 2020: 188,800

There are around 30,000 work pass holders (who are not foreign domestic workers =maids or construction, shipping etc workers.) and work in business related industries.

The rest of Foreigners working in Singapore are maids and constructions workers or manual workers in other industries (factory, cleaning, marine, refinery, street building, tree pruning...). Yes, the number of these manual Foreign workers is on the higher end.

But, tell me whether any single Singaporean wants to take up the jobs of those manual Foreign workers (Bangla and Indians)?

 

Please stop drawing a picture as if Foreigners under EP and S-Pass pose a serious threat to Singaporeans in the workforce.

[Guest Guest]

25 minutes ago, Guest harping wrong song said:

 

 

 

Stop painting an untrue picture!

 

Are 1 mil Foreign Workers competing with Singaporeans for jobs?

 

Clear answer : NO!

 

Do Singaporeans want to do these jobs?

 

Clear answer: No!

 

The EP Holders and S Pass Foreigners only amount to 14.5% of the workforce.

 

Someone else said this before exactly at this thread. Numbers openly confirm this.

 

After the 13.5% boom of growth in 2009 the local workforce was too small to cater for the growth in businesses and jobs. This is the reason for growing numbers in the Foreign Workforce and the government having permitted more EP and S Pass holders to work in Singapore. 

Anyway LKY is the mastermind of this policy.

 

What is your intention of repeating this slogan over and over again?

 

If there is no growth and inflowing FDI then there will not be any increase of job opportunities for locals.

 

You just ignore the facts due to your repeated hatred against Foreigners.

 

The amount of EP Holders and S Pass Holders are still at only 14.5% of the total workforce. The amount of these two groups of Foreign Employees were 11.5% in 2009. 

 

You won't win anyone here with your untrue invented anti foreigner slogans.

 

The cause of current job losses are due to the covid-19 crisis and have no other reason.

 

 

Just to get the numbers right again:

Employment Pass Holders in end of 2019 amounted to 193,700  by end of June 2020: 189,700

S-Pass Holders in the end of 2019 amounted to 200,000 by end of June 2020: 188,800

There are around 30,000 work pass holders (who are not foreign domestic workers =maids or construction, shipping etc workers.) and work in business related industries.

The rest of Foreigners working in Singapore are maids and constructions workers or manual workers in other industries (factory, cleaning, marine, refinery, street building, tree pruning...). Yes, the number of these manual Foreign workers is on the higher end.

But, tell me whether any single Singaporean wants to take up the jobs of those manual Foreign workers (Bangla and Indians)?

 

Please stop drawing a picture as if Foreigners under EP and S-Pass pose a serious threat to Singaporeans in the workforce.

 

denial ... denial ... denial .... even until now, nothing but denial...and why aren't u using the Disclosed Yourself name now?  Or perhaps it's not denial, but brainwashed? 

[Guest I like Brian37 cock]

On 10/4/2020 at 4:54 PM, Brian37 said:

Jia you

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For older and senior pax, hold on to your current job even it’s sucks!

 

as a hiring manager, we prefer hire younger employees as they are easier to manage, less picky and less complain. And cheaper too. Imagine employing a 50s uncle or auntie, keep complaining this and that and under u some more! How to manage! Get a young 20s boy boy or girl girl more obedient! 
 

I have a near 50s colleague, assistant manager, even getting a signature also so difficult for him. Until he get extended his probation period, he buay tahan then throw letter! Lesson learnt, be humble and move on in this challenging job market as you have voted for this governing party! Cheers! Back to my work 😆

[Guest Guest]

10 hours ago, Guest harping wrong song said:

 

Employment Pass Holders in end of 2019 amounted to 193,700  by end of June 2020: 189,700

S-Pass Holders in the end of 2019 amounted to 200,000 by end of June 2020: 188,800

There are around 30,000 work pass holders (who are not foreign domestic workers =maids or construction, shipping etc workers.) and work in business related industries.

 

Wow ... just imagine each and every one of jobs which went into those EP, S-Pass holders gets thrown back to Singaporeans. I think our unemployment rate will be down to ZERO even in this climate. In fact, if only 10% to 20% of those S-pass numbers goes to the fresh grads, I think there will be no fresh grads who are without jobs already. But yet, look at this article in June 2020: https://www.todayonline.com/big-read/big-read-short-job-woes-class-2020

[Guest harping wrong song]

11 hours ago, Guest Guest said:

 

denial ... denial ... denial .... even until now, nothing but denial...and why aren't u using the Disclosed Yourself name now?  Or perhaps it's not denial, but brainwashed? 

 

The one who lives in denial for many years is no one else than you.

 

1) You deny the fact for Singaporeans not taking up certain jobs in the so called "dirty industries".

Would in Singapore there be a requirement for near to 1 Million Foreign Workers in Singapore in construction, marine, cleaning, shipping industries if Singaporeans wanted to work in these job categories?

In Europe and US there is no issue for the locals of these countries to work in the above areas.

Are these workers in any way competing with jobs of Singaporeans?

Then why are you continuously throwing in the numbers of these workers into the figure of Foreigners working in Singapore?

 

2) You deny the fact for only 14.5 % of the workforce are Foreigners in the EP Holder and S Pass categories.

Only these numbers are relevant to look at.

Even if you say the number is faked by the government, then if you double it you reach at 29% (why should the government publish wrong numbers in the first place). Even pretending the number is at 29 % this number would mean 71% are locals in the workforce. The numbers of foreigners in the workforce of Switzerland are not different. But this means with only 14.5 % of Foreigners here in Singapore the number of the relevant Foreigners in the workforce is even half of that in Switzerland!

You simply deny the number of Foreigners in Singapore (in areas where Singaporeans could work in) in the workforce are negligible.

 

3) You deny the fact for not every Singaporean being fit to run in certain high level job categories, but you still pretend only Singaporeans should work as MDs and the top tier level of Management of companies. You even tend to deny FDI investors to Singapore who set up their company here and invested millions into a foreign country to bring in their trusted top tier level management to run the CEO functions.

 

4) You deny the fact for many Singaporeans not wanting certain jobs in the service industry (Customer service, retail, hotel, hospitality, medical...). Would Singapore require to fill these positions with Foreigners if

a) there had been sufficient Singaporeans to do these jobs and

b) there had been Singaporeans wanting to take up such jobs?

 

5) You deny for most job creating in Singapore had been done through inflowing FDI to Singapore.

The Singapore own grown companies are much too small to create sufficient jobs for Singaporeans. If only Singaporean companies had operated in Singapore and not any Foreign investors had set foot here, then probably the unemployment rate had hit the same amount as in Burkina Faso at 77% unemployment.

Do you want these investors to close shop in Singapore?

 

6) You are in complete denial for Singapore not being self sustainable to create sufficient jobs for Singaporeans.

Actually it is not only denial but dumb ignorance.

 

Who is repeatedly harping untruths about the workforce situation and harping on anti-foreigner slogans in Singapore?

 

Who is the one who is in denial of certain given factors in the job market and the economy of Singapore?

 

 

[Guest Guest]

17 minutes ago, Guest harping wrong song said:

1) You deny the fact for Singaporeans not taking up certain jobs in the so called "dirty industries".

Would in Singapore there be a requirement for near to 1 Million Foreign Workers in Singapore in construction, marine, cleaning, shipping industries if Singaporeans wanted to work in these job categories?

In Europe and US there is no issue for the locals of these countries to work in the above areas.

Are these workers in any way competing with jobs of Singaporeans?

Then why are you continuously throwing in the numbers of these workers into the figure of Foreigners working in Singapore?

 

As usual, the deliberate attempt to divert our attention away from the choicer PMETs jobs by trying to bring the topic into those low-end jobs. This is getting to be so lame ... only the attention-deficit people will keep falling into this trap over and over again. 

 

17 minutes ago, Guest harping wrong song said:

2) You deny the fact for only 14.5 % of the workforce are Foreigners in the EP Holder and S Pass categories.

Only these numbers are relevant to look at.

Even if you say the number is faked by the government, then if you double it you reach at 29% (why should the government publish wrong numbers in the first place). Even pretending the number is at 29 % this number would mean 71% are locals in the workforce. The numbers of foreigners in the workforce of Switzerland are not different. But this means with only 14.5 % of Foreigners here in Singapore the number of the relevant Foreigners in the workforce is even half of that in Switzerland!

You simply deny the number of Foreigners in Singapore (in areas where Singaporeans could work in) in the workforce are negligible.

 

Dunno what u talking about this 14.5% figure and this faking of what 29% figure. But HOLY COW! If the entire population holds 14.5% foreigners in EP and S-Pass categories, it'd be a piece of cake to fire all of them and give the jobs to the local Singaporeans! There will be no local unemployment in Singapore and those foreigners can go look for jobs in their own home country!!! 

 

17 minutes ago, Guest harping wrong song said:

3) You deny the fact for not every Singaporean being fit to run in certain high level job categories, but you still pretend only Singaporeans should work as MDs and the top tier level of Management of companies. You even tend to deny FDI investors to Singapore who set up their company here and invested millions into a foreign country to bring in their trusted top tier level management to run the CEO functions.

 

No clue what type of grammatical and logical crap you are talking about here.... 

 

17 minutes ago, Guest harping wrong song said:

4) You deny the fact for many Singaporeans not wanting certain jobs in the service industry (Customer service, retail, hotel, hospitality, medical...). Would Singapore require to fill these positions with Foreigners if

a) there had been sufficient Singaporeans to do these jobs and

b) there had been Singaporeans wanting to take up such jobs?

 

Of course, just pay a good enough salary and anyone will do any jobs. But I guess foreigners are cheaper? 

 

17 minutes ago, Guest harping wrong song said:

The Singapore own grown companies are much too small to create sufficient jobs for Singaporeans. If only Singaporean companies had operated in Singapore and not any Foreign investors had set foot here, then probably the unemployment rate had hit the same amount as in Burkina Faso at 77% unemployment.

Do you want these investors to close shop in Singapore?

 

DBS, StanChart, SIA ... all too small ... yeah right ... what did I say just now?  "the deliberate attempt to divert our attention away from the choicer PMETs jobs by trying to bring the topic into those low-end jobs. This is getting to be so lame ... only the attention-deficit people will keep falling into this trap over and over again. "

 

17 minutes ago, Guest harping wrong song said:

6) You are in complete denial for Singapore not being self sustainable to create sufficient jobs for Singaporeans.

Actually it is not only denial but dumb ignorance.

 

Gosh ... this is soooooo stupid!!! Not enough jobs for Singaporeans but got enough jobs for FOREIGNERS?? Looks who's talking about something "not only denial but dumb ignorance. now??

 

[Guest Guest]

I don't understand why the topic of cleaners and construction work jobs kept coming up for debates.

When we are talking or debating about foreigners...we are talking about PMET jobs!

Stop trying to divert attention.

it's the same with the government, everytime this topic of PMET jobs going to foreigners comes up, they will pretend and talk about how we need the foreign workers for construction and cleaning jobs etc... seriously, it's getting lame....do they even listen to what the issues are in the first place??

[Guest Wake up their ideas]

2 hours ago, Guest Guest said:

I don't understand why the topic of cleaners and construction work jobs kept coming up for debates.

When we are talking or debating about foreigners...we are talking about PMET jobs!

Stop trying to divert attention.

it's the same with the government, everytime this topic of PMET jobs going to foreigners comes up, they will pretend and talk about how we need the foreign workers for construction and cleaning jobs etc... seriously, it's getting lame....do they even listen to what the issues are in the first place??

People who pretend to sleep are hard to wake up their ideas. Use your vote to wake up their ideas. Still got 60% of the ppl still pretending sleep based on last GE results! So u know what to do during next GE

[Guest Guest]

1 hour ago, Guest Wake up their ideas said:

People who pretend to sleep are hard to wake up their ideas. Use your vote to wake up their ideas. Still got 60% of the ppl still pretending sleep based on last GE results! So u know what to do during next GE

 

The problem is they never will wake up. And these people are still subscribing to the usual stuff like upgrading themselves and all the different type of hype, when all these propaganda are nothing more than just illusions to give the masses false hopes, while the choicer jobs are given to other foreigners.

 

I really feel very bad for the person in the article, when he said "To pay for the course and raise money for living expenses, I have to sell my flat. I am single and provide for my parents in their 80s." I wonder how he would feel when the reality of him finishing his MBA and still ending up without a job AND a flat strikes him in the future. 

[sgmaven]

Let's face it, some of your want the cake and eat it as well. Singapore has benefited from global trade and the global economy by being competitive. The fact is, Singaporeans are losing their competitive edge, and real productivity has been plummeting.

 

Aren't those who want their 1st world lifestyle, but shun foreign PMETs, akin to the Americans who want their middle class lifestyle with just a highschool diploma?

[sgmaven]

6 minutes ago, Guest Guest said:

I really feel very bad for the person in the article, when he said "To pay for the course and raise money for living expenses, I have to sell my flat.

I don't agree with his strategy either, but if you bother to look into his career history (go look on LinkedIn), you will see that he already had problems securing employment not long after returning from China.

 

The fact is, whether we are expatriated or go to another country to seek employment, we tend to lose our network and contacts in Singapore. Maintaining our networks and contacts are important, for those who intend to return to Singapore to work at a later date. Unfortunately, many forget to do so.

 

At an entry level, your network and contacts may not be so important, but once you are at junior management (not even middle or senior management), they become almost the most important factor in landing your next job.

 

As numerous HR studies have shown, most successful job candidates actually land jobs through their network, some even before the vacancy is officially advertised.