groyn88 Posted November 23, 2021 Report Share Posted November 23, 2021 https://the-singapore-lgbt-encyclopaedia.fandom.com/wiki/Lawrence_Wong's_views_on_LGBT_rights During a conference on identity politics organised by the Institute of Policy Studies (IPS) and the S. Rajaratnam School of International Studies (RSIS) on Tuesday, 23 November 2021, then Finance Minister Lawrence Wong said that different segments of Singapore’s population, whose identities may be linked to things such as their gender, ethnicity or sexual orientation, had concerns that were important and could not be dismissed as illegitimate or exaggerated[4],[5]. “That is what a fair and just society must mean. And we cannot — in the name of avoiding the dangers of identity politics — deny the rights of a variety of groups to organise themselves, so as to gain recognition for their concerns, or seek to improve their conditions,” he added. For its part, the Government would not let any group feel unheard, excluded or ostracised[6]. Wong last spoke on the topic of race in June 2021 at another IPS-RSIS conference, following a spate of racist incidents at the time. He noted how other aspects of identity had surfaced since then, surrounding gender, sex or other causes that people felt strongly about. “This is not surprising: The natural instinct of humans is to look out for those who are most like us. Around the world, we see the rise of what we might call a ‘new tribalism’ in politics, or ‘identity politics’ as it is commonly described,” he said. In ethnically homogeneous countries like Poland, for example, a “new tribalism” between people emerged out of differences in views on LGBTQ rights, with supporters and opposers of LGBTQ rights in a standoff. He suggested that the rise of tribalism was linked closely to the rise of individualism as the “reigning ethos”, which came at the expense of community and weakened connections between people. This had caused them to fall back on such primeval defences that ran deep in human societies when they felt lonely and alienated. “Tribalism is inherently exclusionary, and it’s based on mutual hate: ‘us’ versus ‘them’, ‘friend’ versus ‘foe’. Once this sort of tribal identity takes root, it becomes difficult to achieve any compromise,” said Wong. “Because when we anchor our politics on identity, any compromise seems like dishonour.” Five approaches Instead of ignoring identities and tribes, Singapore had to recognise that the pull of identity politics arose from real differences in lived realities as a starting point. He suggested five possible approaches to address the competing demands of diverse identity groups while maintaining a cohesive and harmonious society. Firstly, he advocated for Singaporeans to strengthen their spirit of reciprocity and kinship at the daily level, which would ultimately increase the mutual trust between people. “We must be good friends, good neighbours, good Samaritans,” he urged. While the Government could not compel people to build relationships, it could work to gird social norms — in caring for others, kindness and graciousness — that brought people together. Secondly, he said people should avoid assuming that each community was monolithic or homogenous. Referring to his previous speech on race, he said the phrase “Chinese privilege” was a form of stereotype — a female Chinese from a poor background would have a vastly different lived experience compared to a male Chinese from a wealthy family, for example. “Minorities especially are subject to such prejudices; and all of us must be more conscious of the stereotypes we might harbour. We must avoid reducing our understanding of each other to a single dimension,” he explained. He added: “We may be Chinese, Malay, Indian, Eurasian, or any other race. But we are first and foremost Singaporeans. Likewise, regardless of our gender or sexual orientations, regardless of the cause we champion, we are all Singaporeans, first and foremost. Thirdly, while humans were tribalists, Singaporeans were also traders by nature, noting Singapore’s entrepot history. Traders were characterised by the desire to explore the unknown, meet new people to trade and live with, grounded on norms of reciprocity, trust and mutual benefit. “This same instinct is crucial in setting the tone of our society,” he emphasised. "We must continue in this vein — continue to engage with one another, cooperate and work towards mutual benefit. We must do so not only with those outside Singapore, but also between different segments of Singaporeans as well.” That meant listening, understanding, compromising and negotiating for win-win outcomes, knowing that the community will be stronger by cooperation, he said. Fourthly, Wong added that the Government must continue to give Singaporeans reason to “hope and a fair chance to have a good life”, noting the rising inequalities elsewhere in the world that had led to economic woes and, consequently, extreme politics. “We must never allow this to happen in Singapore. So we will continue to work hard to promote inclusive growth, and to ensure that all Singaporeans can succeed in their pursuits,” he explained. Through this, Singapore would be able to break out of having a zero-sum mindset, in which the success of one group came at the expense of another. Lastly, undergirding this was the Government’s duty to be fair and honest, even with the difficulties in establishing consensus on controversial issues. “In such cases, the Government will do our utmost to recognise the challenges and needs of different groups, decide on the appropriate policy, and convince the rest of society that this is a fair way to move forward,” he resolved, referring to policies such as the HDB Ethnic Integration Policy and the Special Assistance Plan for schools. He said the authorities would never waver from its commitment to working with people to broaden common space and to build a society where every Singaporean could express their views and be empowered to effectuate positive change. “We may not always arrive at a perfect solution, but we will never let any group feel unheard, ignored or excluded. We will never let any group feel boxed in or ostracised. All must feel they are part of the Singapore conversation, all must feel they are part of the Singapore family, all must feel there is hope.” Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Citizen Posted November 23, 2021 Report Share Posted November 23, 2021 说的比唱的好听！讲一套做一套。 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
begleitung Posted November 23, 2021 Report Share Posted November 23, 2021 Talk shop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted November 23, 2021 Report Share Posted November 23, 2021 Talk so much, what we want to know is any change after the talk. if not then it is just talk only. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeanMature Posted November 23, 2021 Report Share Posted November 23, 2021 听听就好 Quote Don't read and response to guests' post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlone Posted November 23, 2021 Report Share Posted November 23, 2021 On 11/23/2021 at 3:14 PM, Guest Guest said: Talk so much, what we want to know is any change after the talk. if not then it is just talk only. No nice talk no support. Smart people will know their tactic. Only daft will be fooled ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted November 23, 2021 Report Share Posted November 23, 2021 After all the rhetoric, we are still on own own. Nice pitch using the word "Singaporean" in this speech though. When some people needs support, we are "Singaporeans"; Any other times, we are "CECApore Indians". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Daft Posted November 23, 2021 Report Share Posted November 23, 2021 On 11/23/2021 at 5:17 PM, Since u r here said: wow! all of u thk like tt? then wat more concrete they could do? chg the Law? Daft, as above pointed out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted November 23, 2021 Report Share Posted November 23, 2021 Some of the pushy gays here are completely missing the points in italics and underlined. They just can't wait for the gradual acceptance of lgbt and just want to push their agenda aggressively. Just note that it will only trigger the other camp to do likewise. It's not helping lgbt cause and will only trigger division in the society and create animosity towards lgbts. As LGBTQ attitudes change, Govt too will consider policy adjustments: Lawrence Wong Pink Dot event at Hong Lim Park on June 4, 2016.PHOTO: THE NEW PAPER SINGAPORE - It is entirely legitimate that different groups with different lived realities will organise themselves to promote their own interests, as that is part of how society becomes more open and diverse, said Minister for Finance Lawrence Wong. But he cautioned against taking a confrontational or aggressive approach that seeks maximum entitlements and rights vis-a-vis other groups, or tribes, saying that such an attitude will lead to political tribalism, in which groups close ranks and become insular. This has happened around the world and will quickly erode trust among people. Instead, it needs to be a two-way process with both sides subscribing to norms of reciprocity and mutual benefit, he said. "If you're all talking, pushing, no one is listening. I think we are not having a proper conversation," Mr Wong said during a dialogue at the Institute of Policy Studies and S. Rajaratnam School of International Studies' Conference on Identity. "So the calls for engagement, I think can work if we are committed, not just to a process of advocacy, but also a process of engagement, listening, compromise, negotiation, and constantly expanding our common space." In the session moderated by former ambassador Ong Keng Yong, Mr Wong also spoke about the Government's approach to lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender and queer (LGBTQ) issues. Some members of the audience pointed out that some tribes, such as LGBTQ Singaporeans, had no leverage and could not engage on an equal footing with others. Acknowledging these sentiments, Mr Wong said people have very strong views on sexual orientation and gender identity, and this is the case all over the world. "But I would say to LGBTQ groups that the attitudes are not static, they are shifting," he added noting that the Government frequently engages people, including those from LGBTQ and religious groups, about the issue. "It's very clear (that) sentiment and attitudes are shifting especially among young people, but also shifting for the whole of society." This shows that conversations are not futile, he said, adding: "It's not as though things will be static forever. "As these attitudes and sentiments shift, society will have to think about where the balance might be. And the Government, too, will have to consider what balance would be appropriate for society and what policies we might have to adjust." More on this topic During the session, Mr Wong had cited the change in rules to allow singles to buy Housing Board flats as an example of how policies had evolved to reflect the stronger desire for fairness as society matures. He also said that while policies will be adjusted it would not be possible to accommodate all of the requests of different groups, and stressed that trade-offs would have to be made. He noted that in the US, culture wars between different groups have eroded the trust between people. Urging Singaporeans to keep faith with one another, he said: "When people lose faith with each other, it is very hard to hold a country together. And so what we must ensure is that even with these multiple identities that may take root in Singapore, we should never demonise one another." On its part, the Government will strive to be a fair and honest broker in conversations between the different tribes, and will listen to all sides of the debate, he pledged. He said: "We will attempt to understand how attitudes and mindsets are shifting because they will shift over time. It's not a static position." "And as we do that, where there are policy decisions to be made, we will strive to find the appropriate policy setting. In some instances we may decide after lengthy deliberation and discussion to make adjustments to our policies." More on this topic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest A Yawner Posted November 23, 2021 Report Share Posted November 23, 2021 Scripted, boring piece of repetitive, rhetorics and motherhoods since Time Immemorial. Hearing such speeches, gave me tremendous depression. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted November 23, 2021 Report Share Posted November 23, 2021 Since the beginning of time, minority rights haves only been the concern of the government when it needs to scrape support from every single corner of the electorate. I think they know what's coming with all the ground unhappiness over the COVID situation. The pressure should not be let down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted November 23, 2021 Report Share Posted November 23, 2021 The future PM is paving his way to get acceptance and support from all segments of the population. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve5380 Posted November 23, 2021 Report Share Posted November 23, 2021 The speech of this politician calls more than everything for this lemma: ACTION, not WORDS. Where does he propose elimination of 377A? Where does he propose legalization of same-sex marriage? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonelyglobe Posted November 24, 2021 Report Share Posted November 24, 2021 On 11/23/2021 at 6:45 PM, Guest A Yawner said: Scripted, boring piece of repetitive, rhetorics and motherhoods since Time Immemorial. Hearing such speeches, gave me tremendous depression. Like a news presenter, just present what is written on the script without any personal emotion, feeling or thoughts. On 11/23/2021 at 11:30 PM, Guest Guest said: The future PM is paving his way to get acceptance and support from all segments of the population. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
singalion Posted November 24, 2021 Report Share Posted November 24, 2021 Since Singapore is under the spotlight of their anti discrimination policy on homosexuals from the United Nations Human Rights council.... The Universal Periodic Review (UPR) is a unique State-driven mechanism and significant innovation under the auspices of the United Nations Human Rights Council (UNHRC) that emerged from the 2005 UN reform process. It is the only universal procedure that reviews the human rights situation in all 193 UN Member States and takes place once every four-and-a-half to five years. Report on Singapore regarding the human rights of LGBTI persons 24th session of the Universal Periodic Review January – February 2016 Discrimination against LGBTI persons 1. The continuing criminalisation of sexual activity between men, together with legislative and administrative framework of discrimination of LGBTI persons, constitute violations by Singapore of a number of rights under international human rights law, including the right to privacy and the right to equality and non-discrimination. 2. Section 377A of the Singapore Penal Code, criminalises "acts of gross indecency" between men, including sodomy, and imposes a term of up to 2 years imprisonment. The section applies specifically to men, and may be applied regardless of whether those acts are committed in public or private spaces. In 2007, the State of Singapore undertook a review of its Penal Code, including section 377A. Although the majority of the laws under review were repealed, section 377A was not. Recommendations: The State of Singapore should: 7. Take the necessary measures to eliminate legislation and policies that – in a direct or an indirect way – criminalize same sex relations and discriminate against LGBTI people. 8. Repeal section 377A of the Penal Code and decriminalise sexual relations between men. Recommendations: The State of Singapore should: 26. Take all necessary measures to allow broadcasting of LGBTI content without any kind of restrictions in all media, including print media, television, film and web broadcasting. Since this report Singapore is under more scrutiny by the UN Human Rights council. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
singalion Posted November 24, 2021 Report Share Posted November 24, 2021 On 11/23/2021 at 6:03 PM, Guest Guest said: Some of the pushy gays here are completely missing the points in italics and underlined. They just can't wait for the gradual acceptance of lgbt and just want to push their agenda aggressively. Just note that it will only trigger the other camp to do likewise. It's not helping lgbt cause and will only trigger division in the society and create animosity towards lgbts. What are you saying here? You mean we should all go back to the closet and discreetly hide in public toilets and live a secret double life otherwise we would trigger division in the society or create animosity towards us. Just because we no longer want to be regarded as criminals? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2021 Report Share Posted November 24, 2021 On 11/23/2021 at 5:17 PM, Since u r here said: wow! all of u thk like tt? then wat more concrete they could do? chg the Law? What concrete? They have been giving the same patronizing motherhood statements for the past 15 years and nothing concrete has been done. They seem to expect us to always be the one to compromise and give in and to swallow the bitter pill, and they still got the cheek to claim they try to be a "fair, honest broker". At the very least, they should start by allowing neutral portrayal of LGBT on national TV or loosening the classification of films, like reclassifying Eternals to NC16 if not PG13. I don't think this is too much to ask, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cube3 Posted November 24, 2021 Report Share Posted November 24, 2021 On 11/24/2021 at 2:43 PM, Guest guest said: What concrete? They have been giving the same patronizing motherhood statements for the past 15 years and nothing concrete has been done. They seem to expect us to always be the one to compromise and give in and to swallow the bitter pill, and they still got the cheek to claim they try to be a "fair, honest broker". At the very least, they should start by allowing neutral portrayal of LGBT on national TV or loosening the classification of films, like reclassifying Eternals to NC16 if not PG13. I don't think this is too much to ask, right? Yeeeeaaaahhhh!💪💪💪 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest !!!!! Posted November 24, 2021 Report Share Posted November 24, 2021 Motherhood statements!!!!! 🤑🖕🥱😴 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Citizen Posted November 24, 2021 Report Share Posted November 24, 2021 Government is trying to paint and disguise its own homophobia as a fear of facing LGBT's controversy among citizens. Grow some balls! Gays will not swallow you whole if you embrace them. They are aunties, they ain't monsters! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest why Posted November 24, 2021 Report Share Posted November 24, 2021 On 11/24/2021 at 5:51 AM, Steve5380 said: The speech of this politician calls more than everything for this lemma: ACTION, not WORDS. Where does he propose elimination of 377A? Where does he propose legalization of same-sex marriage? why you stir shit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Stir fry Posted November 24, 2021 Report Share Posted November 24, 2021 When can gays get subsidised HDB when we get married? When will surrogacy and adoption among gay couples be approved? When will gays be able to sign medical procedure approvals for their spouses in hospitals in times of emergency? When will gay sex be decriminalised? When will comprehensive sexualuty education be taught in schools? When can gays legally get married to their same sex partners? SO MANY ELEPHANTS IN THE ROOM!!!!!! LAURINDA WONG, HUH?????!!!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve5380 Posted November 24, 2021 Report Share Posted November 24, 2021 On 11/24/2021 at 2:15 AM, Guest why said: why you stir shit? So a call for ACTION to follow WORDS is for you to "stirring shit"? Isn't this interpretation of yours pure shit? Nightingale 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted November 24, 2021 Report Share Posted November 24, 2021 On 11/23/2021 at 11:30 PM, Guest Guest said: The future PM is paving his way to get acceptance and support from all segments of the population. Since when Singapore PM care for acceptance and support from all segments of the population? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tic-toc Posted November 24, 2021 Report Share Posted November 24, 2021 I don't believe what was said in that speech. Quote If you obey all the rules, you miss all the fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Stir fry Posted November 24, 2021 Report Share Posted November 24, 2021 Mere rhetorics without substance. To substantiate what he appears to be saying, he should bring up the following, outlining clear and concrete steps to achieve them: Gay marriage Gay adoption Gay surrogacy Gay signing for partner's medical procedure during emergency HDB subsidies for married gay couples Comprehensive sexuality education in schools Gay media censorship Gay societies registration Gay anti-diacrimination laws Gay employee protection laws Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doncoin Posted November 24, 2021 Report Share Posted November 24, 2021 On 11/24/2021 at 1:41 PM, Guest Stir fry said: Mere rhetorics without substance. To substantiate what he appears to be saying, he should bring up the following, outlining clear and concrete steps to achieve them: Gay marriage Gay adoption Gay surrogacy Gay signing for partner's medical procedure during emergency HDB subsidies for married gay couples Comprehensive sexuality education in schools Gay media censorship Gay societies registration Gay anti-diacrimination laws Gay employee protection laws Progress takes time to happen. Many of the items you have listed didn't just happen overnight. LGBTQA+ people fought for their rights and it took time for those rights to be drafted into the constitution or law. Homosexuality wasn't decriminalised in the USA on a federal level until 2003 by SCOTUS. If we trace the progress, it started all the way back in 1962 by the state of Illinois, and gradually over the decades more progressive states started the decriminalization process. However, on a federal level, homosexuality can still be considered a crime. So it took about 41 years for the whole United States to decriminalize homosexuality. I think Lawrence Wong's statement is encouraging and hopeful. The LGBTQA+ community needs to work together instead of tearing each other apart to talk to MPs and push for those things. Who is willing to lead the conversation? That is the question. So many here already posted their naysaying that what Lawrence Wong said is lip service. It will be lip service if no one here presses on the government and fight for those rights. All the progress made by LGBTQA+ people in progressive societies did not just happen and the government got woke and decided to have marriage equality. It took years of challenging the government. Even the gay marriage or marriage equality ruling in the USA came as a result of a lesbian widow challenging the Supreme Court. In Singapore, I think to date there has been 3 legal challenges to 377A, and it will take a few more rounds of legal battles before victory emerges. It will take time and brave people to challenge the rules and make the change. mate69 and hotjock 1 1 Quote Love. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Believe at your own Peril Posted November 25, 2021 Report Share Posted November 25, 2021 On Gay issues, I always take the Government's words with a huge tonne of salt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted November 25, 2021 Report Share Posted November 25, 2021 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Yup Posted November 25, 2021 Report Share Posted November 25, 2021 On 11/25/2021 at 12:47 PM, Guest Guest said: Sounds like WP's Raeesah Khan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gozu Posted November 27, 2021 Report Share Posted November 27, 2021 Did i hear Shingaporean? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest O.L. Posted November 27, 2021 Report Share Posted November 27, 2021 Uncle Roger says, haiyaaaaaa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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