City Harvest Church Discussion - Kong Hee & Sun Ho (Compiled)

[bodybuildMLY]

Ok people, back to the discussion on Kong Hee and his "legacy". We are not talking about Form 59, that is such a pure redundant argument. With this I would like everyone to read a blog published by a teenager, and we can see the maturity of today's generation who question almost every belief.

 

http://bizarrobassline.tumblr.com/post/25927852186/city-harvest-church

 

So for those followers of CHC, I would like you, beseech you to read the blog with an open mind. 

[Guest Passingthru]

Actually, come to think of it, in theory, the whole thing can also be considered "illegal/unlicensed deposit taking".  This is because of the promises of divine manifold returns on tithes which makes it an investment.

[Guest Guest]

Actually, come to think of it, in theory, the whole thing can also be considered "illegal/unlicensed deposit taking". This is because of the promises of divine manifold returns on tithes which makes it an investment.

I'm sure Kong Hee didn't mean it literally. If he did, the CHC tithe investment would outperform any bonds on SGX, Nasdaq and the New York stock exchange!

[Guest Passingthru]

I'm sure Kong Hee didn't mean it literally

 

 

But the hypnotised....oops, I mean congregation, obviously took it that way.

[Guest Hong Kee]

The truth has been spoken.

 

Amen!

 

 

Eh eh eh, you don't insult prostitute ok?!? No prostitute I saw has got horsey face like hers.

 

I have a dog, and I will NEVER compare my precious dog to that HO.

 

Prune is good for you, but a half naked wrinkly old something something is not, so cannot put them in same category.

 

But otherwise I fully agree with you.

 

[Guest Sun Whore]

Live and let live?

 

She has obviously strayed. But has she publicly apologised for cheapening Christianity?

 

Has she admitted that it was a massive waste of money to throw millions at fraudulent music producers (Wyclef Jean is also in deep trouble for using up all his Haitian Earthquake charity's money).

 

By calculating amount spent and return.. the project was an obvious failure, and got more negative reaction than anything positive.

 

To pretend nothing has happened.. is called hypocrisy. You cannot just sweep your mistakes under the carpet and stand on a podium and fool people that you have a divine mandate to represent the Lord.

 

Yes the Lord teaches us to forgive and have compassion. But he also taught us to see truth and light, and to to defend it. He also warned us about false prophets.

 

The issue here is not what makes us a better person, but about the audacity and shamelessness of a fame whore masquerading as a church leader.

 

People like her poison our society and our values. She has failed us, and should just go back to being a good humble discreet Christian.

 

The Lord has revealed to us she is not fit to lead. He has clearly shown us how she has used His name improperly.

 

 

 

 

Alright enough already.

Enough of the mean-spirited persecution of Sun and co.

She has strayed by doing that music video. Get over it already, it's so 2007.

The woman has followed up with a pretty decent song called Fancy Free with positive energizing lyrics.

After the scandal broke she has returned to church to lead worship which she is still doing.

Why can't you guys just live and let live?

Why must you guys keep rubbing salt into her wound?

Does that make you a better person?

Let it go already.

 

[Guest Hi]

If this is what you called " Super Star "

庭上爆出，何耀珊出一张专辑，亏损高达1437万。

而这笔巨额亏损，是由印尼富商哈纳菲“填补”，还钱给艺人管理公司Xtron。

城市丰收教会创办人兼牧师康希（48岁）、管委会副主席陈一平（40岁）、管委会会员林岭恒（45岁）、原投资经理周英汉（52岁）、前财务经理黄玉音（36岁）和财务经理陈绍云（37岁）涉嫌串谋失信公款，昨天进入第4天审讯时，辩方昨午盘问控方证人许丽亲时，爆出一封电邮的内容。

许丽亲在教会工作期间是黄玉音下属，后来加入Xtron，负责账目等事务。

http://news.omy.sg/News/Local-News/Ting-Shang-Liang-Bao-He-Yao-Shan-Chu-Zhuan-Ji-Yu-1437Mo-167452

出专辑烧掉2000万

5人签字保证捧何耀珊到底

何耀珊出专辑烧掉2000万元，5人之前签字保证，要多少给多少，捧何耀珊到底！

这两份在2007年8月签的担保书，一份是哈纳菲以个人名义签的，保证承担何耀珊“跨界计划”的任何损失，包括专辑及进军美国等事项。一份是康希、陈一平、周英汉与许少毅4人联名，给哈纳菲做担保。

也就是说，“跨界计划”有双重担保，哈纳菲承担计划的所有损失；4人承担哈纳菲的损失，等于是得到5个人的全力资助。

控方因此要Xtron前董事许少毅解释，为何要哈纳菲签名担保。许少毅表示，哈纳菲非常支持跨界计划，亏损也愿承担，在教会内是广为人知的事，因为康希曾在教会礼拜时公布消息，签名担保只是“书面”文件。

http://news.omy.sg/News/Local-News/Chu-Zhuan-Ji-Shao-Diao-2000Mo-5Ren-Qian-Zi-Bao-Zheng-Peng-He-Yao-Shan-Dao-Di-167814

 

 

 

So... did Hanafi pay for the loss finally? If not, did Ps Kong and the rest paid for the loss? 

[bodybuildMLY]

Why Snowball likes to post in Chinese? Me no understand leh

[Guest gust]

Well, it could be that Snowball finds it more natural to express himself in Chinese than in English.  For the benefit of those who cannot read Chinese, here is the translation of his posting (which is actually from newspaper).

 

Snowball wrote his first sentence in English:

If this is what you called " Super Star "

 

And then he presented what was written in the Chinese version of the newspaper:

“It was revealed in the court that Ho Yeow Sun incurred a loss of up to $14,370,000 for the album.  And this huge loss was borne by the Indonesian tycoon Wahju Hanafi, who refunded artiste management company Xtron.

City Harvest Church pastor-cum-founder Kong Hee (aged 48), vice chairman of the Charity’s Board Tan Ye Peng (aged 40), Agent & Executive Member Lam Leng Hung (aged 45), the  former investment manager Chew Eng Han (aged 52), the former finance manager Wee Gek Yin Serina (aged 36) and financial manager Tan Shao Yuen Sharon (aged 37) are suspected of collusion breach of trust for public funds.  The trial entered its fourth day yesterday.  The content of an email was revealed during the cross-examination of prosecution witness Koh Li Ching by the defendant yesterday afternoon.

Koh Li Ching was Wee Gek Yin’s subordinate when working in the church.  She then joined Xtron to be responsible for the accounts and other matters.

 

http://news.omy.sg/N...u-1437Mo-167452

 

The album made a loss of $20,000,000.  There were 5 signatories who pledged their total support for Ho Yeow San all the way, regardless the amount of money needed.

This two copies of the guarantee were signed in August 2007.  One was signed by Hanafi to personally bear whatever losses that would be incurred by the Crossover Project, including making the album and entering the American market etc. The other copy was jointly signed by Kong Hee, Tan Ye Peng, Chew Eng Han and Koh Siow Ngea as collateral guarantors to Hanafi.

That is to say, the Crossover Project has a double guarantee:  Hanafi to bear all losses of the Project and the four people to bear Hanafi’s losses, which means to say that all five people pledged their full funding

 

The prosecution therefore wanted the former director of Xtron, Koh Siow Ngea to explain why Hanafi was obliged to sign as a guarantor.  Koh Siow Ngea said Hanafi greatly supported the Crossover Project and was willing to bear the losses.  This fact was well-known and thus Kong Hee announced it during the Church worship and that the signing of the document was a mere written formality.”

http://news.omy.sg/N...n-Dao-Di-167814

 

 

Thanks. So... since there were losses, did Hanafi bear the losses as promised? Or no news of this was heard anymore.

[Cyberus]

I say live and let live.If people choose to be blind and act as fools their whole life then let it be.It's their own damn choice.

[snowball]

Sun ho has this message for her supporters who gave and gave...till they cried.

为什么人的丑陋丑态被媒体公诸于世后, 才来玩这套?

之前为何又肆意挥霍无度? 几千万并不是几千元。

什么是以上帝之名? 这就是上帝的宗旨吗?

明知会亏损还故意如此, 用意居心何在, 大家心知度明。

公众的眼睛是雪亮的, 并不是盲目的群众, 这几套是否管用?

坦言, 我并不讨厌何耀珊, 她的早期华文歌我还蛮欣赏的,

但我厌倦, 那些以上帝之名而为达到满足私欲, 道貌岸然的人。

还是那句老话, 拭目以待吧。

Edited May 26, 2013 by snowball

[sportsboysg]

can the CHC fans just tell me..

 

why crossover projects only consist of only one beneficiary ... Sun Ho. Its not a group, its nothing, its an old lady trying to be sexy.

 

Many members including Jack Neo, but was not invited to join the crossover project

[Guest i am not a fool]

can the CHC fans just tell me..

why crossover projects only consist of only one beneficiary ... Sun Ho. Its not a group, its nothing, its an old lady trying to be sexy.

Many members including Jack Neo, but was not invited to join the crossover project

are you kidding , if jack neo is invited , do you think he will jolly agree with it , he is not a fool , ho is not his wife , what for he want to throw his money away for nothing , his movies can make a lot of money and his recent part 1 & 2 ah boy even shown in taiwan.

[Guest LONEly NIGht]

Why people go to their regular prayer? That's the process of brain washing. you would not understand their action cos they have justified throughout the process of praying.Any question only invite hatred . See how the world mess up with clashes of religions.

[Guest LONEly NIGht]

See, people using God s name to make this world their play ground

[Guest YishunGuy]

Why Snowball likes to post in Chinese? Me no understand leh

yah, I also catch no ball. Snowball, your Chinese very powderful! Which part of China are u from?

 

Also, I think the 'supporters' arguing here so aggressive is just one main person taking up different personas and stirring up everyone. Such a slut!

[Guest Sun]

You responded!! So you admit you have the SLUT stirring up shit. Pretening to be multiple personalities. Siao! Why you so slutty??! CB too itchy is it? Nothing to do? Go suck a banana! offer your CB mouth and drink some real man juice!

 

你搞什么鬼？你不要跟我太过分！

[bodybuildMLY]

You can see the argument here, despite the title being Kong Hee / CHC saga.

Those who support the above mentioned will harp on Sun Ho's "past successes" in MandoPop, China Wine, etc, etc.

Those who don't (including me) will question issues such as the fundamentals of CHC, credentials, their authority, beliefs, etc. also, we will question the validity of the Crossover Project, which no one has yet to comment on the basis / objectives, cause-and-effect and outcome of the project (and its impact). A lot of questions posed here are left unanswered.

Do note we are not speculating on the outcome / verdict which will be met out on KH, as well as the embezzlement evidence.

A penny for your thoughts

[G_M]

Since you people don't understand what is the meaning of OFF Topic post will be removed, and since so many of you are going off topic, which means this topic had run its course.  

 

Thus it will now be locked. 

 

Go and flame and spew ur thoughts on slut or whatever you want in the Flaming Room.http://www.blowingwind.org/forum/index.php?showtopic=33401

[Guest Guest]

Chew Eng Han has left City Harvest Church with immediate effect.

The church has issued a statement saying they don't understand why he is leaving

More information to follow.

[Guest Guest]

Possibly a plea bargain with prosecutors.

He may have evidence implicating Ho Yeow Sun.

What do we know?

[Guest 55]

its a conspiracy ! he'll leave SG branch and contribute to other branches elswhere EG. KL, Indonesia ?

the longer he stays, he'll need to give evidence aganist SUN HO ma. This Queen cannot afford to go Changi villa :twisted:

[Guest Guest]

He is a defendant in the criminal trial, he has evidence of his own to be adduced at the trial.

This won't change regardless of whether he's in City Harvest or not.

So why did he leave the church? And why now?

Plea bargain? Falling out with CHC board and management?

Any more defendants going to leave CHC soon?

Your guess is as good as mine.

Stay tuned.

[gz69a]

The Attorney Chambers has a history of successful prosecution especially when it comes to commercial crimes.  They would have the evidence and would have done very thorough examinations before filing the charges.  How many cases have not come to Court we do not know but those that are charged will find it tough to get off the hook.

 

And overturning the convictions at higher courts have been rare.  Let justice prevail.  If innocent, let them go.  If guilty, may they get due punishment.

[Guest Guest]

whos chew eng han??

[Guest god]

Kong Hee is like god to his followers.

[Guest Guest]

Kong Hee is like god to his followers.

Obviously not to Chew Eng Han anymore :clap:

[Guest observer]

He wrote this statement to all CHC members :

 

Personal Statement From Chew Eng Han

June 21, 2013

Dear friends in CHC,

The time has come for me to make a major shift in direction for my life. I’ve thought and prayed through this for many months, and on balancing the pros and cons of it, I now have a deep conviction that that the right thing to do is to depart from City Harvest Church (CHC).

CHC is my first and only church and in the 17 years there, I have been fed the Word of God and learnt to grow in spiritual strength and faith. For that, I am deeply grateful. Many members of the church have qualities which are not easily found elsewhere – tenacity, faith, love for people, generosity, perseverance and loyalty. If certain events had not overtaken this wonderful experience, CHC would undoubtedly continue to be my one and only church.

For those who do not know me well and have not heard me out, I hope you will not jump to conclusions about me and the appropriateness of such a move. Those who know me better will understand what I’ve been seeing and tolerating – wrongful labelling, quick to take credit and to pass the buck, betrayal, slander, ingratitude, denial and lies, manipulation and control, greed, pride, hypocrisy, abuse of authority, practice of favoritism and different standards. it is exacerbated when it is perpetrated by top leaders, including those who taught us that the Word is supreme and that obedience to the Word equals loving God. Leadership cannot be measured by words but by action. Nobody qualifies to lead, or to preach what he cannot practise in real life. More than anything, these are foremost issues of spiritual and moral significance.

I realize these are strong words, but nevertheless I do believe no one has to be afraid of speaking the truth. Otherwise we are in bondage to man and their man-made rules. Jesus Himself did not mince words when dealing and confronting certain issues or persons, because He carried the Spirit of Truth, which we similarly do. We are also given the gift of the Holy Spirit to discern between right and wrong, truth and untruth, and then to take a stand for what is right and true.

Above personal reasons, I firmly believe that everyone is entitled to have a go at knowing and walking in the truth, and those who withhold it from the masses will be held accountable by Him for consensual silence. I fear God, not man. Unity is good, but it cannot come at the expense of truth and justice and be imposed for the personal benefit of a few. True unity is linked to the Spirit of God, of Truth and Justice, and edifies all, not a select few.

Hopefully, many will kindly remember me as one who has poured out his whole life and has tirelessly fought for the cause of this church – be it in the property search, the crossover, or the reputation of the leadership. It takes a lot for me to make a sharp turnaround, but we do have to make difficult decisions at important crossroads of our lives, and this is such a decision. In the end, principles such as accountability, honesty, fair-dearling, justice and truth will for me take precedence over position, popularity, recognition and acceptance.

My wish for all in CHC is that everyone will focus his eyes and heart on Jesus Christ, who is and can be the only Foundation of the church. God bless you and be with you all.

 

Is this going to be a case of  "大难临头 各自飞"，you die your own business?

 

 

[LFM]

thanks observer. truely, a profound self-disclosure of one's own conviction of issues confronted with.

[azimuth]

God is truth and the truth will be out soon.

[Guest Guest]

Mix the China wine with the dutty wine...

[Guest observer]

So now, someone from the CHC inner circle is claiming to be not afraid to speak the truth about the leaders there.

 

"wrongful labelling, quick to take credit and to pass the buck, betrayal, slander, ingratitude, denial and lies, manipulation and control, greed, pride, hypocrisy, abuse of authority, practice of favoritism and different standards".

 

And now we will all know that such wonderfully graceful deeds are actually taking place in CHC all the time by their leaders!!!!

And its not hearsay anymore!

 

[Guest Lowsk]

Admirable! High time to call sin, "sin."

[Guest Guest]

SINGAPORE: The trial of the five leaders of City Harvest Church and one former leader resumed on Monday with a director linked to the church testifying against them.

Choong Kar Weng, director of Xtron Productions, a firm that used to manage singer Sun Ho's music career, took the stand as the prosecution's fourth witness.

The Singapore permanent resident was questioned about his ties with the accused and also his role in Xtron.

The court heard how Mr Choong joined the church in 1995 and was asked to be a board member from 1999 to 2004.

He also recalled how he was asked by church founder Kong Hee, one of the six accused, to join Xtron as its director even though Kong Hee was not part of Xtron.

The six accused, including Kong Hee, face varying counts of criminal breach of trust.

The prosecution is alleging that the six accused made unauthorised use of S$24 million of the church's building fund to boost singer Sun Ho's music career.

Sun Ho is a leader at the church and also the wife of accused, Kong Hee.

Some of the six accused allegedly used another S$26 million to cover up the first sum, through what the prosecution calls "sham bond investments".

These investments were made in Xtron, Firna and Ultimate Assets.

Firna and Ultimate Assets are owned by Wahju Hanafi, whom the prosecution is alleging has close ties to the church.

Mr Wahju is slated to testify in this tranche of the trial.

In all, nine prosecution witnesses have been lined up for this part of the trial.

On Monday morning, church supporters were seen queuing outside the Subordinate Courts from as early as 4.15am, similar to when the trial started in May.

Singer Sun Ho also arrived in court at about 9.15am to accompany Kong Hee. 

 

[Guest Kaypo]

I don understand w the church ppl still supports kong hee after the scam is surfaced... Are they all possessed or what?

[gstc82]

I don understand w the church ppl still supports kong hee after the scam is surfaced... Are they all possessed or what?

that's what I wonder.

Now. If the tens of thousands of CHC members supports Sun ho n kong"s actions, is it wrong? This is so strange.

Is it a crime if these tens of thousands of people willingly throw millions to sun to let her gyrate with wyclef n eat organic strawberries n live the high life?

Edited August 27, 2013 by gstc82

[RealityCheck]

My cousin attends CHC, and he still supports the church even though the leaders have been in such controversies. I too wonder about why the congregation still support.

But maybe let's look at it from a "religious" point of view.

 

After so many years of being told about "God" by these people. They have already believed that their actions are to "God" and "God" alone. Won't it make any sense that though their leaders of the church has been taken down, the will that has been imprinted to these people would still continue? I mean, it's just my 2 cents, correct me if I'm wrong.

[Guest Passingthru]

People continue supporting a blatantly wrong organisation or personality because of:

 

-  peer pressure from the well developed social ecology,

-  loyalty due to the "new life" they have experienced,

-  unnecesary fear of divine retribution,

-  misguided/imagined closeness to the Divine,

-  a slave mentality,

-  worldly pursuits like networking, financial returns and other "rice bowl" issues, and last but not least,

-  an unassailable belief that they belong to the real path to salvation.

 

In such a climate and environment, abuse is seen as a privilege.

[Guest Guest]

People continue supporting a blatantly wrong organisation or personality because of:

- peer pressure from the well developed social ecology,

- loyalty due to the "new life" they have experienced,

- unnecesary fear of divine retribution,

- misguided/imagined closeness to the Divine,

- a slave mentality,

- worldly pursuits like networking, financial returns and other "rice bowl" issues, and last but not least,

- an unassailable belief that they belong to the real path to salvation.

In such a climate and environment, abuse is seen as a privilege.

And being in denial for the fear of acknowledging they have been duped all these while..

[gstc82]

People continue supporting a blatantly wrong organisation or personality because of:

- peer pressure from the well developed social ecology,

- loyalty due to the "new life" they have experienced,

- unnecesary fear of divine retribution,

- misguided/imagined closeness to the Divine,

- a slave mentality,

- worldly pursuits like networking, financial returns and other "rice bowl" issues, and last but not least,

- an unassailable belief that they belong to the real path to salvation.

In such a climate and environment, abuse is seen as a privilege.

but when I asked my CHC friend, he was not with other CHC members! N he supports not only the church but also kong n his wife!

[Guest Guest]

Saw her recent picture with her hubby on papers, her face looks so plastic, is that where all the money are going to now that her apparent even lackluster career is going nowhere now, even Cher looks so much better

[fab]

I don understand w the church ppl still supports kong hee after the scam is surfaced... Are they all possessed or what?

 

Misplaced faith.

[Guest Passingthru]

 

but when I asked my CHC friend, he was not with other CHC members! N he supports not only the church but also kong n his wife!

So the peer pressure reason doesn't apply but the other reasons do.  Having said that, one doesn't need to have peers physically around to feel pressurised.

[Guest Raiden Alpha]

Christianity have peer pressure.

Chc is no longer a place of worship, it is a social club for members and public alike to indulge in gossips and speculation on people lives/morals.

This church should be close down and ban in this country just like the moonies church.

[kee_hsiao]

the power of religion... it causes one self to lose their critical judgement of what is reported against their belief... scary.

[gstc82]

Christianity have peer pressure.

Chc is no longer a place of worship, it is a social club for members and public alike to indulge in gossips and speculation on people lives/morals.

This church should be close down and ban in this country just like the moonies church.

how do u know? Even if we do not like the church, why should it be banned and closed? Do you think this is year 1980? This is year 2013! Are you for openness if society or do you want a more controlled society? Whatever "bad" you think CHC or anything is, it's the choice of people to join or not.

[Guest Raiden Alpha]

how do u know? Even if we do not like the church, why should it be banned and closed? Do you think this is year 1980? This is year 2013! Are you for openness if society or do you want a more controlled society? Whatever "bad" you think CHC or anything is, it's the choice of people to join or not.

Deviants and social ills need to be arrest at the roots before it take hold on the populace. The authority do have the power and judgement to administer ban and exile on harmful subjects. This is a part of their duty to the people they serve. Openness should not be abuse.

Beside there are tons of other churches for one to go pray to the father son and Holy Spirit. Unless one only want to follow the pastor and practise human deifying, in that case they can go changi to praise him' should' the verdict really come out and prove him guilty.

[gstc82]

Deviants and social ills need to be arrest at the roots before it take hold on the populace. The authority do have the power and judgement to administer ban and exile on harmful subjects. This is a part of their duty to the people they serve. Openness should not be abuse.

Beside there are tons of other churches for one to go pray to the father son and Holy Spirit. Unless one only want to follow the pastor and practise human deifying, in that case they can go changi to praise him' should' the verdict really come out and prove him guilty.

Orh. Lol

[Guest Raiden Alpha]

Orh. Lol

Off topic a bit.

I hope you made a blunder and get sack today.

[gstc82]

Off topic a bit.

I hope you made a blunder and get sack today.

why do you wish a Singaporean to be sack? Even if its one you hate. This goes to show once again you are nothing but false prophet. As long as a Singaporean or anyone who disagree with you, you will curse him to the living daylights. And yet you say you "went to gates of hell" for Singaporeans. Lol. What you want is a government who control it's people more tightly and control what it's people do, listen, think and hear.

Why are you cursing at Singaporeans? Are you anti singapore?