City Harvest Church Discussion - Kong Hee & Sun Ho (Compiled)

[Guest wozzit]

CHC pressure tactics! 'Nuff said!

[Steve5380]

From:

After 13 Years, I'm Leaving Christianity

in huffingtonpost.com: 

 

---------

For years and years of listening to the prosperity gospel in church, I had been brainwashed into giving thousands of dollars. Well perhaps deep down, I was trying to "pay my gay sins away." I suspect many closeted gay Christians out there are doing the same. They keep themselves busy with God and the church to avoid the need to come to terms with their true self.

During my four years in university, I took the responsibility to educate myself on the subject of homosexuality. I stopped letting one specific group of people dictate how I should view myself, and other gay people.

I began to see that what it means to be gay is really my own business. How I want to live my life is my choice, not some other people's.

Additionally, I have come to realize that being Christian had shut my mind to concepts and ideas that may be foreign or opposite to our beliefs. No, the problem isn't with Christianity, but the so-called followers of Christ. I can no longer identity with their self-justifying competitiveness, their outright hypocrisy, the hate they harbor towards what their ignorant (brainwashed?) minds do not understand, and the disregard some groups have towards something alien to their belief system.

Dear Christians, do know that just because you think you're right doesn't mean that everyone else is wrong.

Losing my Christian beliefs has definitely helped me see more beauty in the world, especially in other religions and ways of life. While I was studying abroad in India in 2013, and traveling in Japan in 2014, I found that my openness and new attitude had led me to a deeper appreciation of other faiths. I've also become more respectful toward my own family's traditional beliefs.

Though I no longer consider myself a Christian, I'm still keeping a space for God in my heart. I didn't lose my religion. Instead, I'm creating my own. I don't believe that we humans can live and function happily without any belief or faith in something outside of the physical world we live in.

We all need hope -- in something bigger and more powerful than ourselves. Though I think a lot of the time that something cannot be found from the without -- not from the church, or other believers who are more fervent than you, or the priest, or money.

But only from within ourselves.

 

You have reached the good fortune of "creating your own religion",  that is, trust your own reason in guiding your spirituality, regardless of influences from other people.   And this does not mean to abandon Christianity.

 

You merely put aside the fairy tales and nonsense created around the figure of Jesus to present him as a God.  But the moral principles expressed by this real or imaginary figure Jesus in the gospels, regardless of where this information comes from, are positive and have strong appeal.

 

So you can still be a Christian in the philosophical sense,  like someone can be an Aristotelian by following this man's philosophy without him having to be a God. 

 

It helps to see the religious Christians with all their fanaticism and idiocy as VICTIMS of the religious organizations who exploit and feed from religion.  There is no need for religion.  It is better to recognize our emotions for what they are, instead of attributing them to something 'supernatural'.

 

The Ho couple with all their dealing and wheeling in religion and their abuse of some preaching skills that allowed them to build a religious empire full of lies and deceptions,  is not to be envied but pitied.  WHO would like to be in the shoes of Kong He and his wife TODAY?  Imagine the stress of a criminal prosecution and the shame of a disastrous attempt at artistic fame!  They got and hopefully still get more of what they deserve. And those suckers who are their sheep are not too innocent either, they enjoyed their pride and their belief that they would gain a lot by supporting that church.  And if they keep doing it, so much more they deserve what they get for not being able or willing to see reality.

[Guest ilovetaylorswift]

There's an article in The New Paper today about my favourite Taylor Swift vs a certain China swine.

It makes for one helluva intriguing read.

[Guest wozzit]

A number of posts hv disappeared. May I ask the mods if they will eventually be added to the Flaming Room thread on Sun Ho? It wld be a pity to lose them altogether I think.

[Guest Guest]

Taiwan musician Ayal Komod aka 张震岳 has stood out in support of Sun and Kong Hee

 

http://ent.china.com.cn/2015-10/25/content_36884269.htm

 

[FluteGuan]

Actually... Ayad supports Jesus and denounces religious organisations that preaches prosperirty gospel... http://m.nownews.com/n/2015/10/24/1855652 he compares the money grabbers whp uses religion for their own gains, as rats. Just google. ☺

Edited November 8, 2015 by FluteGuan

[Guest Guest]

Taiwan musician Ayal Komod aka 张震岳 has stood out in support of Sun and Kong Hee

http://ent.china.com.cn/2015-10/25/content_36884269.htm

Do u read mandarin?

[Guest wozzit]

From The New Paper online edition 8 November 2015

 

KONG HEE AND SUN HO PAID FOR EXPENSES FROM ACCOUNT MADE UP OF "LOVE GIFT" DONATIONS

CITY HARVEST CHURCH FOUNDER AND WIFE PAID FOR EXPENSES FROM MULTI-PURPOSE ACCOUNT MADE UP OF CHURCH MEMBERS' DONATIONS

 

Nov 8, 2015 6:00am

BY NG JUN SEN 
AND RONALD LOH

 

According to Court proceedings, City Harvest Church founders King Hee and Ho Yeow Sun lived a life of luxury using a secretive multi-purpose account (MPA), through which selected donors gave "love gifts" to the pastors.

​A yet-to-be-published document shows that donors gave nearly $3 million to the MPA, while the couple drew out around half of that as Sun's music artiste salary, royalties and bonuses.

MPS donor Ms Lu Jiahui defends the "love gifts".

Says Ms Lu: ''Think about this as though you are contributing to your boss' birthday and you can give however much you want. Someone sets up a birthday fund for the office and the money is put in there.

''Eventually, whether the money is spent on the birthday cake or the decorations is besides the point. I just know that I gave the money away as a birthday present, and I trust the person to handle it.''

 

 

[Steve5380]

A number of posts hv disappeared. May I ask the mods if they will eventually be added to the Flaming Room thread on Sun Ho? It wld be a pity to lose them altogether I think.

 

Hahaha...

 

The flaming posts may have been removed but nobody will take away our satisfaction of writing them.  In this sense they have accomplished their purpose, and if they are short lived there is no loss.  After all, BW should live up to a good civil standard.

[Cube3]

On Pastors Who Live In Mansions...just not right!

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/formerlyfundie/rich-pastors-peoples-stupidity/#st_refDomain=www.facebook.com&st_refQuery=

[upshot]

Yes GOD will Punish the Witch.....   GOD = Governmental Official Departments.

[mith]

BURN THE WITCH!

[Cube3]

100k for hair...?! Burn! :twisted:

[Guest Dan]

Support my foot!

Guest is twisting & distorting facts again, thinking she can deceive those who cannot read Chinese.

Come, let me do the translation.

何耀珊老公挪用公款2亿被判决 张震岳:被耶稣打脸

10月25日讯 据台湾媒体报道，创作歌手张震岳是虔诚的基督教徒，小时候因参加教会唱诗班，开始对音乐产生兴趣，成为歌手后，也唱红许多经典歌曲。他常在脸书上表示对时事的看法和生活点滴，对于先前歌手何耀珊的丈夫挪用教会公款，他也公开炮轰对方“被耶稣打脸”。

歌手何耀珊一直以“牧师娘”的特殊身分与清亮嗓音受人瞩目，不料，她的牧师老公为了帮她继续发展歌唱事业，惊爆涉嫌挪用公款约台币11.6亿元(约2.27亿人民币)，并于22日遭到当地法院判决，震惊娱乐圈。

此一消息也受到同样身为基督徒的张震岳关注，他24日在脸书公开发表对宗教信仰的看法，直言自己“爱耶稣，但不爱宗教”，并认为所谓“信仰”是自己的神佛、 菩萨、阿拉之间亲密隐私的接触，跟任何教会、庙宇的形式无关，“明了的人却寥寥无几，那么多教派，人多就作乱。” 痛批现在的人利字当头，搞分裂再组新教会的行为就跟“老鼠会”一样，还说道：“我真的很希望耶稣再来一次，把这些人啪啪啪的打脸。”一番言论也引网友赞同。

Sun Ho’s Husband Convicted for Embezzling 200 Million.

Ayal Komod (Chang Chen-yue): Slapped by Jesus

October 25. According to Taiwanese media reports, Chang Chen-yue is a devout Christian who, as a child, attended his church choir & became interested in music. After becoming a singer, he popularised a number of classic songs. He often expressed his views on current events & life on Facebook. He lambasted the singer Ho Yeow Sun's husband as “being slapped in the face by Jesus” for misappropriating public funds.

Singer Ho Yeow Sun has all along been in the limelight, riding on her special status as a "Pastor's Wife" with a crispy voice. Unexpectedly, her pastor husband, in helping her further her singing career, has been charged with embezzling about NT$1.16 billion yuan (about 227 million rebminbi), and was sentenced by the court on the 22nd,, shocking the entertainment circle

.

This news drew the attention of Chang Chen-yue, who is a Christian himself too. In his Facebook on the 24^th, he stated his religious view as “I love Jesus, but do not love religion.” He stated that the so-called "religion" is one’s private contacts with one’s god, Buddha, Allah & has nothing to do with any church or temple. "Very few people understand religion. With so many denominations with so many people, confusion is bound to arise." He chided society for being utilitarian & engaging in secessionism before setting up new churches, acting like "rats’ meetings". He added, "I really hope that Jesus will come again one day to slap these people on their faces." Such remarks has found consensus among netizens.

Hi there, a few line wrongly translated...

[Guest wozzit]

Sun Ho's drama queen is back. Better she sticks to the Flaming Room. There she will see the little poem I have written about her little angel - Ho! Ho! Ho! Ho!

[Guest ilovetaylorswift]

I just watched these 2 very obscure music videos by Sun Ho : China Wine & Mr Bill. Right now I am swinging between exasperation and frustration. Like, whaaaaatttt???

What kind of songs are these??

Give me Taylor anytime babe.

[Guest wozzit]

I just watched these 2 very obscure music videos by Sun Ho : China Wine & Mr Bill. Right now I am swinging between exasperation and frustration. Like, whaaaaatttt???

What kind of songs are these??

 

Aha! These r gospel songs to convert souls to Christ. Didnt u hear all the references to God in them?

 

Well, no its not ur hearing. There just arent any! N guess what? No one converted! Shame!

 

Give me Taylor anytime babe.

 

 

Taylor Swift is a stunning singer n performer who gives a great deal of her own money annually to all sorts of charities. Shes a wonderful human being.

[Steve5380]

This news drew the attention of Chang Chen-yue, who is a Christian himself too.  In his Facebook on the 24^th, he stated his religious view as “I love Jesus, but do not love religion.”  He stated that the so-called "religion" is one’s private contacts with one’s god, Buddha, Allah & has nothing to do with any church or temple.  "Very few people understand religion.  With so many denominations with so many people, confusion is bound to arise."  He chided society for being utilitarian & engaging in secessionism before setting up new churches, acting like "rats’ meetings".  He added, "I really hope that Jesus will come again one day to slap these people on their faces."  Such remarks has found consensus among netizens.

 

Thanks for the translation.

This Chen-yue has the right perspective regarding religion.

[Steve5380]

I just watched these 2 very obscure music videos by Sun Ho : China Wine & Mr Bill. Right now I am swinging between exasperation and frustration. Like, whaaaaatttt???

What kind of songs are these??

 

Why not take it with humor?  You are not a member of CHC who had to buy these junk videos...

 

And it is very improbable that the Sun Ho will continue making videos like those...

[snowball]

华文报章头条新闻之一，chc教会有四十余人捐赠300万给康夫妇。没兴趣知道详情，所以没买来阅读，但如果是教徒心肝情愿，旁人也无话可说，不是吗?

[mith]

华文报章头条新闻之一，chc教会有四十余人捐赠300万给康夫妇。没兴趣知道详情，所以没买来阅读，但如果是教徒心肝情愿，旁人也无话可说，不是吗?

 

是,无话可说。。。只是为这些认贼做父的人感到可惜！300万可以救到很多很多贫苦家庭，但却浪废在禽兽不如的康夫妇上！

[mate69]

是,无话可说。。。只是为这些认贼做父的人感到可惜！300万可以救到很多很多贫苦家庭，但却浪废在禽兽不如的康夫妇上！

 

In their so-called "journey to proselytise", the couple got lost in the dizzying world of fame, fortune and most importantly, misplaced priorities

to let lust for money and luxury affect their "Godly pursuits", however you want to define these.

 

It's a shame. And they should rightly be punished for it. Especially those found guilty of misdeeds.

 

The sheer amount of money, as mith has pointed out, could have been put to so many other more sustainable, achievable and worthy causes.

 

Pity.

[Steve5380]

In their so-called "journey to proselytise", the couple got lost in the dizzying world of fame, fortune and most importantly, misplaced priorities

to let lust for money and luxury affect their "Godly pursuits", however you want to define these.

 

It's a shame. And they should rightly be punished for it. Especially those found guilty of misdeeds.

 

The sheer amount of money, as mith has pointed out, could have been put to so many other more sustainable, achievable and worthy causes.

 

Pity.

 

That loss can be lessened if the CHC scandal reaches sufficient people and makes them realize the big deceptions perpetrated by the majority (if not all) of the MEGACHURCHES.  And in this state of mind, if they dig a little further, they could realize that this deception is a characteristic of ALL the organized religions.

[Guest wozzit]

With the discussion becoming less heated Id like to make a comment abt some of the CHC vdos I have been watching on youtube. Two points stand out for me.

 

The first is the number of youngsters present. Now this may just b the cameraman selecting a particular group - but I suspect not. The second is that these youngsters did seem to b finding something in the services that genuinely pleased them/they enjoyed/they connected with. Put aside for a moment all the concerns already expressed about brain washing, pressures to give cash, pressures from parents to join, cell leaders etc. Cld it b that at least some of these young guys n girls actually find a sense of community - perhaps even a sense of purpose in their lives - which was lacking before they joined CHC? 

 

I heard n read quite a lot of comments abt people finding it hard to b part of todays society, to make friends n so on. In one sense perhaps an organisation like CHC can b compared to a large social club. The sad thing is that its a social club with a whole lot of rather nasty strings attached. N the pity is that these youngsters seem to think there is no other way in the Singapore community to socialise n make friends.

[Guest wozzit]

CHC uses pop instruments & lighting effects to simulate pop celebrities singing, thus arousing the same craze level as in the Korean pop concerts.  Such that even a pastor's wife Sun Ho has to resort to dressing skimpily & singing "China Wine", nicknaming herself Geisha to "elevate" her popularity status.  So it all seems very "cool" and "hip" for youths to join CHC.  By the way, such a means to use super-trendy tunes & lighting effects in Islamic mosques & Buddhist temples will be unthinkable.

 

Interesting comments - thanks. They lead to another. If Buddhism n Islam have vast followings yet do not need to "update" the presentation of their religions, why is it that Christianity does? It cannot all b just to hoodwink congregations n get cash out of them. Christianity may be on the wane in many countries but there r still others where traditional services n activities attract vast numbers - as in the Philippines n parts of Africa n South America.

 

Just curious!

[bodybuildMLY]

Interesting comments - thanks. They lead to another. If Buddhism n Islam have vast followings yet do not need to "update" the presentation of their religions, why is it that Christianity does? It cannot all b just to hoodwink congregations n get cash out of them. Christianity may be on the wane in many countries but there r still others where traditional services n activities attract vast numbers - as in the Philippines n parts of Africa n South America.

 

Just curious!

 

We can't do that because we are not allowed to innovate in terms of worship / prayers. It will be a heresy.

[Steve5380]

I heard n read quite a lot of comments abt people finding it hard to b part of todays society, to make friends n so on. In one sense perhaps an organisation like CHC can b compared to a large social club. The sad thing is that its a social club with a whole lot of rather nasty strings attached. N the pity is that these youngsters seem to think there is no other way in the Singapore community to socialise n make friends.

 

I have personally seen how well organized the social interaction between teenagers is at CHC. Is this good for the children?  It may not be all positive. Totalitarian regimes go to big length to recruit the young into exclusive groups where they get social, economical privileges. The most evil example was the Hitlerjugend in Nazi Germany.  Similar youth groups exist, existed in Cuba, some dictatorships in South America. This tactic in CHC is similar although not so evil.  Their brain-washing is religious more than political, patriotic.  Instead of Heil Hitler they sing Heil Christ.  The same worship of some idealized "superior being". 

[upshot]

With the discussion becoming less heated Id like to make a comment abt some of the CHC vdos I have been watching on youtube. Two points stand out for me.

 

The first is the number of youngsters present. Now this may just b the cameraman selecting a particular group - but I suspect not. The second is that these youngsters did seem to b finding something in the services that genuinely pleased them/they enjoyed/they connected with. Put aside for a moment all the concerns already expressed about brain washing, pressures to give cash, pressures from parents to join, cell leaders etc. Cld it b that at least some of these young guys n girls actually find a sense of community - perhaps even a sense of purpose in their lives - which was lacking before they joined CHC? 

 

I heard n read quite a lot of comments abt people finding it hard to b part of todays society, to make friends n so on. In one sense perhaps an organisation like CHC can b compared to a large social club. The sad thing is that its a social club with a whole lot of rather nasty strings attached. N the pity is that these youngsters seem to think there is no other way in the Singapore community to socialise n make friends.

 

Well that was my story in my early post where I talk about where I worked my next door neighbor was not a company but a new startup Christian "church' where almost all the followers are young from teens to young adults and all are mainly from good schools, colleges, universities... These are the higher future earners. they are targeting..  That is Singapore.. since you are base in HK

 

It is almost well known where they will marketing and also woo new people.. apart from doing so at the schools, they target areas where you find such young people and also those location tend to be places where more well off people hang or shop. All low level areas and places where you find other races with non Christian religion tend to go, they will not be there to recruit new converts. Another place where I in my younger days got 'tag' was at Funan Centre... which is like the higher class IT mall in Singapore. From twice, someone lady came up to me and ask me for the time and when I told her the time, she said that is not what she ask, she was asking if it was not TIME TO FIND JESUS. *roll eye* hahahahah... Brush them off after telling them I have given up on that lie. heh.

 

Using women is a common thing too especially like the small Mormon group in Singapore and also other denominations of Christianity. Yes I have had my share for that directly from decades so it is not something I made up.

 

As I said, that church next door within one year of opening, got a full band instrument set (bass.lead guitars, keyboard with synthesizer, full drum kit with electronic drum machines ).. good enough for a public performance, a platform and good furnishing, Apple computers for multimedia work with large screen projectors, ....etc. and yes a large rock of a diamond of the wife. It was a couple who started it after leaving their church. Targeting the young is good and with the right tactics.. social building parties and all that plays a very big part and once hooked. Yo have a steady stream of monthly salaries coming in to you.

 

As I said, I was born Catholic, spend a year or so as Methodist, Mormon, seven day Adventist, christian group at some office unit like the one I talked about. If you ask enough questions, get no straight answers, you see more pressure to give money and influnce to conform..etc. if you in the first place have no need for spiritual help or you tend to be someone who think a lot about things or question things told to you, you soon find out.. it is all the same nonsense with smoke and mirror monkey show. For about 2 decades was all I am willing to give up and without them and adopting Buddhism which are more about philosophy teaching yo how to live your life then asking me for money all the time... my life is way much better, more well explained and kept me more satisfy.  EVEN if there is only one life to live now and no heaven out there.

 

You make the best use of your time on earth.  It is indeed a privilege to be born.

 

So experience it yourself then to give away money and time to let someone like Kong Hee or SUN HO to live that privileged rich lifestyle which the sheep will never get to see their home, be taken along on their performance tour, sit on the air plane in first class, have million dollar homes in the US..etc...while you go to their church to sing hymn and praise god and still go home to your smaller ground houses and for majority of sheep, tiny flats and smaller income.

 

With all things equal, how come they get to live the millionaire lifestyle unlike the thousands of sheep ( including Jesus) that goes to their church or praise god? Jesus praise god his father right? He also managed to spread the religion and made many followers and for that he is killed. But your Kong Hee and all people like him around the world spread his religion and become millionaires instead. wow.. Never strike you as odd?

 

If you complain that the PAP govt personnel gets too high a salary for serving a nation, these few fuckers serve only a few thousand but they get even more money then the PAP to spend leh. You still can not rationalize the problem with that scenario? You are really one gullible and simple minded person.

Edited November 9, 2015 by upshot

[Guest Guest]

City harvest christians, pls bear in mind these people r criminals. They planned their crimes deliberately, carefully, laboriously, thoughtfully n meticulously. U need not defend n stand by them. R there not other churches u can go to? Do u worship god or pastors?

[Guest Guest]

Sun Ho's singing had improved tremendously from last time! If she is singing live in those clips, she sounded incredible! Now she sounded like a true diva, whereas in the past, she sounded more like a wannabe recording artiste. Maybe the millions of dollars afforded her excellent singing lessons and vocal training! But i still think she tried tooo hard in the mtvs.

[Guest Guest]

Humility As It Should Be

http://9gag.com/gag/agNbOVx

That could be mere window dressing. The catholic church finally tried to go on trial with the child abuse cases, but its only through their own internal trial process, which could amount to nothing. Pope francis secretly met with and vocally supported kim davis the homophobic clerk during his recent usa trip, but refused to meet with child abuse victims of the catholic church says a lot about his conviction for changes and reforms to the catholic church.

[Guest wozzit]

Pope francis secretly met with and vocally supported kim davis the homophobic clerk during his recent usa trip, but refused to meet with child abuse victims of the catholic church says a lot about his conviction for changes and reforms to the catholic church.

 

Incorrect! He met with child abuse victims. It was widely reported.

 

http://edition.cnn.com/2015/09/27/us/pope-francis-sex-abuse-victims/

[Guest Guest]

Incorrect! He met with child abuse victims. It was widely reported.

http://edition.cnn.com/2015/09/27/us/pope-francis-sex-abuse-victims/

I got it wrong. He refused to meet the organisation for abused lgbts. Correct?

[Steve5380]

Taoism is losing believers as Chinese turn away from their parents' faith. Christianity is growing its flock and Buddhism is also seeing a revival   Chinese religions here, specifically Taoism, have been trying to stem the bleed of believers from their ranks, but their followers are still abandoning them for Christianity.  Seven in 10 here considered themselves Taoist nearly 90 years ago, but recent census figures have charted their declining "share" – from 30 per cent of the population in 1980 to 22.4% in 1990 and 8.5% in 2000.  Christianity, on the other hand, has grown its flock to 14.6% of the people here in 2000, up from just 5.2% in the 1920s to 10.1% in 1980 and 12.7% in 1990.

. . . .

Christianity has grown here amid an evolving social context: The population has become more educated.  English has also grown in use, and brought with it a Western world view & culture.   Language appears to be the biggest factor accounting for Christianity's expansion here, said Associate Professor Phyllis Chew, a linguist at the National Institute of Education. National University of Singapore sociologist Alexius Pereira confirmed it: "There's a 'leakage' from traditional Chinese religions, which don't seem to have the same appeal to younger people."

He added that over the last 40 years, Christianity has drawn the educated, English-speaking Chinese whose parents followed traditional religions.  The charismatic movement, with the attendant rise of the "mega-churches", those with

members numbering in the tens of thousands, was a factor in the growth of Christianity.  Mega-churches such as the 24,000-member City Harvest are known for using marketing and pop culture to win over the young.

 

It is such a pity that an Asian population is abandoning its traditional religions for Christianity.  Those religions full of spirituality being dropped in favor of a collection of fantastic stories and fairy tales.  Of course, who doesn't love the figure of Jesus?   The eye-tearing sacrifice, the preaching of pure love, the attractive rituals, and...  and the promise of eternal life in a paradise.

 

This must have a parallel with the surging of junk food chains in Asia.  This food is sooo  tempting!  I remember a few times in Singapore walking into a McDonald to savor a big mac with french fries during some longing for home,  even if at home I would never dream to step into a McDonald...  The Western junk food is making the former nice Asians FAT,  and the Western religion is turning the former wise Asians into dumb suckers of religious fantasies.

[Steve5380]

That could be mere window dressing. The catholic church finally tried to go on trial with the child abuse cases, but its only through their own internal trial process, which could amount to nothing. Pope francis secretly met with and vocally supported kim davis the homophobic clerk during his recent usa trip, but refused to meet with child abuse victims of the catholic church says a lot about his conviction for changes and reforms to the catholic church.

 

Pope Francis is too intelligent to fuel more condemnation of his church due to its abuse of children. 

 

The close meeting between Francis and this homophobic clerk Davis turned out to be an invention of the clerk and her lawyer, and was refuted by the Vatican.

 

The pope met with victims of sex abuse at the end of his trip to the US and expressed solidarity for their suffering and determination to prosecute the guilty.

 

He is doing all he can to return an image of decency to his church.

[Guest Guest]

It is such a pity that an Asian population is abandoning its traditional religions for Christianity. Those religions full of spirituality being dropped in favor of a collection of fantastic stories and fairy tales. Of course, who doesn't love the figure of Jesus? The eye-tearing sacrifice, the preaching of pure love, the attractive rituals, and... and the promise of eternal life in a paradise.

This must have a parallel with the surging of junk food chains in Asia. This food is sooo tempting! I remember a few times in Singapore walking into a McDonald to savor a big mac with french fries during some longing for home, even if at home I would never dream to step into a McDonald... The Western junk food is making the former nice Asians FAT, and the Western religion is turning the former wise Asians into dumb suckers of religious fantasies.

LOL! Steve if you are singaporean, i've vote for you as our prime minister!

[Guest Guest]

Pope Francis is too intelligent to fuel more condemnation of his church due to its abuse of children.

The close meeting between Francis and this homophobic clerk Davis turned out to be an invention of the clerk and her lawyer, and was refuted by the Vatican.

The pope met with victims of sex abuse at the end of his trip to the US and expressed solidarity for their suffering and determination to prosecute the guilty.

He is doing all he can to return an image of decency to his church.

The vatican admitted the pope met with kim davis after his return. They denied during his trip to prevent unecessary attention to the marriage license issue while for his trip.

[Steve5380]

Sun Ho's singing had improved tremendously from last time! If she is singing live in those clips, she sounded incredible! Now she sounded like a true diva, whereas in the past, she sounded more like a wannabe recording artiste. Maybe the millions of dollars afforded her excellent singing lessons and vocal training! But i still think she tried tooo hard in the mtvs.

 

This episode with CHC and seeing the above video...   is a valuable exercise in ACCEPTANCE.

 

Acceptance that there is evil in the world. 

A world where there is deception everywhere.

Where churches, who should be free of it, are instead full of it.

 

It looks like the Hee and Ho will be redeemed. 

Redemption is such a strong tool in religious techniques.

Apostle Paul was a horrible enemy of Christians....   until he was redeemed by his vision of Christ.

The thief who was crucified besides Jesus...  was redeemed and joined him in paradise.

 

IT'S SO EASY:

Do the crimes, sin to your heart's content, and then...  redemption comes along and lifts you up.

 

Maybe after this scandal, Kong Hee and Sun Ho will emerge stronger than ever, being able to blabber about their redemption, how Christ made them see the light and by his Grace made them stronger and holier.  "And continue to give us your donations".

[Steve5380]

The vatican admitted the pope met with kim davis after his return. They denied during his trip to prevent unecessary attention to the marriage license issue while for his trip.

 

The Pope met with a bunch of other people, the Davis did not get a private audience with him.

[Guest Guest]

What's with that 70s wide-bottom flare bootcut pants kong hee's wearing that sweeped the stage as he pranced around? I don't see anyone wearing that anymore on the streets?! He might as well stick some glitter on his pants, grow out his sideburns and spot a pompadour! That'll make him SMOOTHER still! Lol

[Guest Guest]

The Pope met with a bunch of other people, the Davis did not get a private audience with him.

http://edition.cnn.com/2015/10/02/us/kim-davis-pope/

Somehow it transpired that kim davis and her "spokesperson" fabricated the private meeting. They met but not in private, according to the pope's advisor. Somehow, i don't trust either side's veracity of words.

[Guest Guest]

Sun Ho with gay porn director Chi Chi La Rue in West Hollywood, Los Angeles, November 2009.

 

Source: Sun Ho's Twitter ("The fabulously inimitable Chi Chi La Rue goes Fancy Free!!")

 

[Guest Guest]

China Wine (high definition) on WyclefVevo:

 

[Guest Guest]

Singapore Wine

 

[Guest Guest]

Sun Ho with gay porn director Chi Chi La Rue in West Hollywood, Los Angeles, November 2009.

 

Source: Sun Ho's Twitter ("The fabulously inimitable Chi Chi La Rue goes Fancy Free!!")

 

That's why 我只信 lan jiao !

[Guest wozzit]

I got it wrong. He refused to meet the organisation for abused lgbts. Correct?

 

Sorry I do not know if he was asked to meet them or not.

 

The close meeting between Francis and this homophobic clerk Davis turned out to be an invention of the clerk and her lawyer, and was refuted by the Vatican.

 

 

No he did meet with Davis n her husband. They were secretly driven to the Vatican Embassy at night. I suspect that it was less to do with her stance of gay marriage licences than on the Popes long held views on conscientious objectors. Spin perhaps?

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/30/us/county-clerk-kim-davis-who-denied-gay-couples-visited-pope.html?_r=0

 

It is such a pity that an Asian population is abandoning its traditional religions for Christianity.  Those religions full of spirituality being dropped in favor of a collection of fantastic stories and fairy tales.  Of course, who doesn't love the figure of Jesus?   The eye-tearing sacrifice, the preaching of pure love, the attractive rituals, and...  and the promise of eternal life in a paradise.

 

 

Yet arent some of the Asian religions - especially Taoism that u mention - also very much concerned with eternity after life on earth? To me it does seem strange that this is being abandoned in favour of Christianity n its "fantastic stories n fairy tales" - unless here r more appealing earthly reasons?

[Guest wozzit]

Sun Ho with gay porn director Chi Chi La Rue in West Hollywood, Los Angeles, November 2009.

 

Source: Sun Ho's Twitter ("The fabulously inimitable Chi Chi La Rue goes Fancy Free!!")

 

 

What on earth was Sun Ho doing being seen in public with a personality named in 2007 as one of Out magazines 50 top most influential people? This is surely a huge scandal!

 

Chi Chi La Rue is an admitted alcoholic and drug addict! This is a hard core gay porn mogul who worked for years with the gay Catalina porn movie company. In 1998 he directed a racy music do for Judas Priest frontman Rob Halfords band 2wo. This featured strippers n girl n boy porn stars. Understandably it was never shown on MTV.

 

Was Chi Chis soul saved by Sun Ho? Sorry to disappoint all CHC members, Chi Chi La Rue was back in rehab at the Betty Ford clinic in June this year! We know CHC through its executives crimes had provided Sun Ho with very expensive PR consultants. Why on earth wld they allow a woman of the "church" (allegedly) not only to be seen with this man but post a photo of the meeting on her own twitter account?

 

More than anything that shows how Sun Hos gallivanting for years in the USA was for one reason only - mega expensive publicity, publicity, publicity.

[upshot]

Pope Francis is too intelligent to fuel more condemnation of his church due to its abuse of children. 

 

The close meeting between Francis and this homophobic clerk Davis turned out to be an invention of the clerk and her lawyer, and was refuted by the Vatican.

 

The pope met with victims of sex abuse at the end of his trip to the US and expressed solidarity for their suffering and determination to prosecute the guilty.

 

He is doing all he can to return an image of decency to his church.

The pope is like Obama... A President but little power.. what little he does is minimum as his Vatican are ensuring he still have to toll the line in the more deep rooted propaganda and long term tactic.

 

The little things he does is what make him seem more human to the eyes of the simple folks. Just like Obama with is off the grid act like going out without his jacket and entering a fast food joint to buy some burger for himself and some staff. Charming but again. like the tactic use by Kong Hee. It is to humanized him to the mass just enough that they can suck punch their way with their hidden agenda.

 

This pope is all words but what you don't see is the action underneath that. The Catholic church is more then just a pope that is doing  everything. You can not tell what is happen till it is too late just like the raping of little children decades later. Keep watching.. his term has only just begun. Don't just look to what he is doing and saying. but at what he is not saying or doing in front of the smoke and mirrors.

[upshot]

Yet arent some of the Asian religions - especially Taoism that u mention - also very much concerned with eternity after life on earth? To me it does seem strange that this is being abandoned in favour of Christianity n its "fantastic stories n fairy tales" - unless here r more appealing earthly reasons?

 

 

I could go on for a long paragraph on this topic alone but suffice to say, on the surface over the years.. Western has use better PR, psychology and Marketing to win them over.

Edited November 10, 2015 by upshot

[Guest Guest]

I could go on for a long paragraph on this topic alone but suffice to say, on the surface over the years.. Western has use better PR, psychology and Marketing to win them over.

It's that stupid "angmoh dua lee" thinking again lah! Which is true but says little ablut their real personalities and charactor. Another window dressing that asians just love, especially when imported by angmohs.