Discussion on Muscle Building, Weight Lost, Weight Gain, Gym Workout

[heliumduck]

:/ Dank man...Alright i guess to polyclinic then...Anw thanks. U r the man(:

 

how did ur doctor visit go ?

maybe u're just tight in the shoulder, upper pec region?

stretch and warm up?

[OneBlanket4us]

how did ur doctor visit go ?

maybe u're just tight in the shoulder, upper pec region?

stretch and warm up?

Haha...Decided not to as there was no more pain after 2 days. Tried again flyes today and last Thurs, and realised there is no pain. So I conclude the pain was due to first time doing flyes^^

[Carpenter]

Before I become quite busy, I was able to track of whatever I was consuming. Since I'm quite busy now, I don't have time or sometimes even forget to input my calorie intake for that whole day.it is especially hard if I eats outside, I can't be too picky to only pick healthy foods. N I am gonna get confused if I have track the calories of each ingredients in the foods.

Just got to eat a lot more. Healthy snacks in between. What i've been observing is that people always say that they have difficulty putting on weight in this forum. Not the first. I somehow believe that when we think about it, how sure are we when we say we consume a lot? How much is a lot? Do people keep track of what they have been eating? Even when i get my participants in my study to write down their food content in the food log and then I calculate the amount of calories that they eat, more often than not, people under-estimate their calories. What is a lot to most people might in fact be insufficient. Perhaps this might be one reason why we don't see growth or gain in weight. If you want, just do a food log for yourself for just 5 days of the week then you calculate the amount of calories on your own.

[xydboy]

Please read your first post, where you brought in Chocolate Milk as the subject of "Many Studies" that find it efficient in muscle recovery.  NOT as a source of protein.

 

And I replied that with my love for chocolate, I could justify my eating of its ice cream by its alleged effects in muscle recovery.

 

But I don't need to take anything for muscle recovery. The best for muscle recovery is to have good planning. 

 

Delayed onset muscle soreness should be very rare in a person who exercises regularly.  Maybe it happens when changing the exercise regime, which should not be too frequent, if some new muscles start to get involved.  But if one practices enough compound exercises this should be rare as well.

 

Muscle recovery after the exercise is a necessity that should be planned in the exercise scheduling.  In my case I partition the training into three groups: lower body, upper body and aerobics,  and I work on each group twice a week.  Some exercises in a group, like heavy squats, I do with heavy weights one time and more light the second time, so I leave one week of recovery for the heavy squats.  

Although I go to the gym six days a week my muscles get plenty of recovery,  without having to do anything special to force them to recover.  My daily 8 hours of sleep also help recovery.

 

So dear fellow,  your suggestion of chocolate milk I take with plenty of humor... and gratitude.

 

Thank you for suggesting that I eat a tub of chocolate ice cream after each workout.  You are really looking out for my enjoyment!

But the pleasurable should be done in moderation, otherwise the pleasure gets lost.

The pleasure of eating so much ice cream is not the same as the pleasure of having good sex after each workout.  I rather would do the latter, if I would need it.

My friend, when I brought in the chocolate milk for protein recovery, research shown that "These effects (consumption of milk) could be the result of positive influences on glycogen resynthesis, protein turnover, muscle disruption, rehydration, or a combination of these factors." and one of the major component is due to the presence of sufficient protein and carbohydrates within the milk. With that being said, one particular study pointed out that even with insufficient carbs, as long as there is sufficient protein, it would stimulate sufficient muscle protein accretion, thus aiding recovery (Staples et. al. 2011). One popular review article by Pasiakos, S. M. et. al. (2014) studied on the effects of protein supplements on muscle damage, soreness and recovery of muscle function and physical performance. It was found that protein ingested results in the various intracellular signaling that is related to muscle protein synthesis and breakdown process. Hence this is the reason why I mentioned what I mentioned. My research was on protein ingestion and muscle recovery, if you are interested in more articles, I will be more than willing to give you my reference list. Cheers!

[xydboy]

Before I become quite busy, I was able to track of whatever I was consuming. Since I'm quite busy now, I don't have time or sometimes even forget to input my calorie intake for that whole day.it is especially hard if I eats outside, I can't be too picky to only pick healthy foods. N I am gonna get confused if I have track the calories of each ingredients in the foods.

 

Actually no need to write down. there's a myfitnesspal app, it is quite useful. They have quite a huge amount of data base of food within it (if my memory serves me correctly). So its really easy and hassle free.

[gymfan32]

Before I become quite busy, I was able to track of whatever I was consuming. Since I'm quite busy now, I don't have time or sometimes even forget to input my calorie intake for that whole day.it is especially hard if I eats outside, I can't be too picky to only pick healthy foods. N I am gonna get confused if I have track the calories of each ingredients in the foods.

 

 

I feel you bro. I am in a similar situation, always to gain weight (muscle weight). But I am actually quite lazy, in a sense that I am always trying to find the motivation to record my training log. So doing a food log would be something that I would find it difficult to do as well.

 

For me, it can be quite common to have irregular meals due to my work. But I would try to squeeze in some foods, like energy bars, fruits etc. I don't really count my calorie intake, cos' most of the time I am eating less than I should. Even if I eat more, somehow it burns off very quickly due to my metabolism. 

[Steve5380]

Before I become quite busy, I was able to track of whatever I was consuming. Since I'm quite busy now, I don't have time or sometimes even forget to input my calorie intake for that whole day.it is especially hard if I eats outside, I can't be too picky to only pick healthy foods. N I am gonna get confused if I have track the calories of each ingredients in the foods.

 

Good. Tracking calories can be a waste of time. 

 

The important thing remaining is to eat healthy foods, or in a less strict way, NOT to eat too much food that is junk.  For example, bring with you a pack with natural almonds and other good nuts to snack instead of falling for the salty potato chips from the vending machine.  Drink water instead of coca cola, sprite, etc.

 

Once you eat good food the quantity is not so relevant, listen to your stomach when it is full.  Avoid waiting too long between meals and getting too hungry. Ideally, you would eat when it is time to do so instead of being driven by hunger.

[Carpenter]

Actually no need to write down. there's a myfitnesspal app, it is quite useful. They have quite a huge amount of data base of food within it (if my memory serves me correctly). So its really easy and hassle free.

That's what I use to track my foods, but some datas are based on which countries they r living in hence the proportions are different. Ex. Pizza hut's Hawaiian pizza in Indonesia n hongkong might vary in size, weight, n even ingredients. The calories will def not be the same, so if the dates that I get didn't match up, I usually have to input it myself n would just 'assumed' of the cals amount.

[Steve5380]

I feel you bro. I am in a similar situation, always to gain weight (muscle weight). But I am actually quite lazy, in a sense that I am always trying to find the motivation to record my training log. So doing a food log would be something that I would find it difficult to do as well.

 

For me, it can be quite common to have irregular meals due to my work. But I would try to squeeze in some foods, like energy bars, fruits etc. I don't really count my calorie intake, cos' most of the time I am eating less than I should. Even if I eat more, somehow it burns off very quickly due to my metabolism. 

 

I never in my life counted calories, and I am surviving quite well at my ideal weight.  And I have been in your situation of irregular schedules.  

Many "energy bars" are unhealthy and made with questionable components.  Instead, bring with you foods that are nutritionally dense,  like nuts, dried fruits, pieces of cheese, dark chocolate. 

[Carpenter]

I feel you bro. I am in a similar situation, always to gain weight (muscle weight). But I am actually quite lazy, in a sense that I am always trying to find the motivation to record my training log. So doing a food log would be something that I would find it difficult to do as well.

For me, it can be quite common to have irregular meals due to my work. But I would try to squeeze in some foods, like energy bars, fruits etc. I don't really count my calorie intake, cos' most of the time I am eating less than I should. Even if I eat more, somehow it burns off very quickly due to my metabolism.

I wouldn't say I'm lazy to count my food intake, but its bc of my daily life become busier. I do have to say if i keep on eating different foods or foods that have been mixed with lots of ingredients then I'm lazy to count.

I used to be 52 then on school break I started wo again n start to track my cals intake n in just 3 months I gain about 7kgs. After the breaks over, I stop tracking n starts deflating again. My sleep patterns n gym sessions also kinda messed up now.

[Steve5380]

My friend, when I brought in the chocolate milk for protein recovery, research shown that "These effects (consumption of milk) could be the result of positive influences on glycogen resynthesis, protein turnover, muscle disruption, rehydration, or a combination of these factors." and one of the major component is due to the presence of sufficient protein and carbohydrates within the milk. With that being said, one particular study pointed out that even with insufficient carbs, as long as there is sufficient protein, it would stimulate sufficient muscle protein accretion, thus aiding recovery (Staples et. al. 2011). One popular review article by Pasiakos, S. M. et. al. (2014) studied on the effects of protein supplements on muscle damage, soreness and recovery of muscle function and physical performance. It was found that protein ingested results in the various intracellular signaling that is related to muscle protein synthesis and breakdown process. Hence this is the reason why I mentioned what I mentioned. My research was on protein ingestion and muscle recovery, if you are interested in more articles, I will be more than willing to give you my reference list. Cheers!

 

Thank you for your information.  I am somewhat disillusioned that the chocolate is not the principal helper, but I'm still satisfied that the protein in milk is so positive.

I consume about one liter of milk every day in the form of yogurt.  I make this yogurt myself with the 2% milk and a little yogurt from the store as the starter, using a yogurt maker that keeps the mixture at constant warm temperature for 8 hours overnight.  I don't add any sugar or other stuff, so my yogurt is healthier than what I buy in the store, and cheaper.  I eat it during the day as a significant source of protein plus millions of probiotic bacteria that are perfect for digestion. 

[xydboy]

That's what I use to track my foods, but some datas are based on which countries they r living in hence the proportions are different. Ex. Pizza hut's Hawaiian pizza in Indonesia n hongkong might vary in size, weight, n even ingredients. The calories will def not be the same, so if the dates that I get didn't match up, I usually have to input it myself n would just 'assumed' of the cals amount.

Depends on which country you are at, in singapore, there's the health promotion board where the nutrition stuffs are catered more for the local context.

[OneBlanket4us]

Depends on which country you are at, in singapore, there's the health promotion board where the nutrition stuffs are catered more for the local context.

Yep. I just started using iDAT app by Health Promotion Board. The good thing about the app is that it provide caloric values of local food. 

[xydboy]

Yep. I just started using iDAT app by Health Promotion Board. The good thing about the app is that it provide caloric values of local food. 

Yeap, that's a very useful app too. My senior was part of the development in that app. Not an easy feat to have it developed, but glad that it serves good purpose now.

[bluerunner]

Yep. I just started using iDAT app by Health Promotion Board. The good thing about the app is that it provide caloric values of local food.

thanks for sharing.

[Guest Ener]

So, regarding muscle recovery. Sure chocolate milk is a good and cheaper alternative. Problem is am abit sensitive to diary products but not lactose intolerance. Soo I went to GNC got myself Endurox R4, this is in powder form Gatorade/100plus kinda drink so non-diary and easy on the stomach. I took it once during and after a game.(suppose to take right after the game but what the heck, hahaha) Definitely it felt better the next day, muscle still felt sore but not the move abit pain kind. It felt pulling instead of sore. Soo it's just after one session and I can't confirm the product reliability yet. It's $54 after discount at gnc.. soo I hope its true to what it says.. Hahaha..

[xydboy]

So, regarding muscle recovery. Sure chocolate milk is a good and cheaper alternative. Problem is am abit sensitive to diary products but not lactose intolerance. Soo I went to GNC got myself Endurox R4, this is in powder form Gatorade/100plus kinda drink so non-diary and easy on the stomach. I took it once during and after a game.(suppose to take right after the game but what the heck, hahaha) Definitely it felt better the next day, muscle still felt sore but not the move abit pain kind. It felt pulling instead of sore. Soo it's just after one session and I can't confirm the product reliability yet. It's $54 after discount at gnc.. soo I hope its true to what it says.. Hahaha..

There are soy/beef alternatives for whey, if you want you can get them. Its not that cheap for the amount of glucose and protein ratio. For 52g of carbs (which I think its present in the product from google), you can use get glucolin from NTUC which is like very cheap ($6.75 per container, each serving 40g). For people who just started working out, you would need more protein due to a greater net protein catabolism that occurs during training, however with repeated and frequent bouts of training, this amount gets lesser and lesser, which means your body adapts and gets more efficient to perform that same workload.

[CamperBoy]

Time to up the game! Diet mode on. Hahaha

Anyone used PAM spray before?

[Guest Ener]

There are soy/beef alternatives for whey, if you want you can get them. Its not that cheap for the amount of glucose and protein ratio. For 52g of carbs (which I think its present in the product from google), you can use get glucolin from NTUC which is like very cheap ($6.75 per container, each serving 40g). For people who just started working out, you would need more protein due to a greater net protein catabolism that occurs during training, however with repeated and frequent bouts of training, this amount gets lesser and lesser, which means your body adapts and gets more efficient to perform that same workload.

Hey thanks for the input, I shall go check it out.

[bluerunner]

Anyone used PAM spray before?

You beat me to ask that. I do not find any shops selling pam spray here. Perhaps there is .... but I do not know.

[CamperBoy]

Lol just bought it. At cold storage!

Trying now hHahah

[bluerunner]

Lol just bought it. At cold storage!

Trying now hHahah

Which outlet under which section?! I was at Cold Storage China Square and Cold Storgse Bugis. I did not find it?

[CamperBoy]

I bought at Yishun cold storage. Not bad.

And if you are cooking bland food, eat it with Franks Red Hot sauce! Hahah

[bluerunner]

I bought at Yishun cold storage. Not bad.

Thanks for sharing. Muack.

[TheKaze]

Calories deficit, calories surplus.. Is there anyway to lose fat mass while concurrently gaining muscle mass? Current fat percentage is about 14% ,trying to lose about 2-3% more to make abs more prominent, however am also hoping to build a more muscular arms/chest. Any tip or guide. Thanks in advance

[iwearthongs]

I used to drink lot of milk, especially the HL milk during breakfast, lunch & after workout. Now I stopped drinking and I noticed my body become more toned. I also switched my protein source to fish and eat more vege now. Feels much better compared to last time when I ate too much rice and less healthy protein sources like beef.

[heliumduck]

Time to up the game! Diet mode on. Hahaha

Anyone used PAM spray before?

 

whats this?

[SuperSentai]

Calories deficit, calories surplus.. Is there anyway to lose fat mass while concurrently gaining muscle mass? Current fat percentage is about 14% ,trying to lose about 2-3% more to make abs more prominent, however am also hoping to build a more muscular arms/chest. Any tip or guide. Thanks in advance

http://seannal.com/articles/training/cardio-while-bulking.php

[xydboy]

Calories deficit, calories surplus.. Is there anyway to lose fat mass while concurrently gaining muscle mass? Current fat percentage is about 14% ,trying to lose about 2-3% more to make abs more prominent, however am also hoping to build a more muscular arms/chest. Any tip or guide. Thanks in advance

One very recent meta-analysis conducted compared exercise (cardio vs resistance training), diet and combination of both. It was found that diet and resistance exercise was useful in the retention of fat free mass and losing fat mass (source: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4429709/pdf/40200_2015_Article_154.pdf). So do remember to include lots of resistance training exercises. I think that arms and chest are over-rated. I would advise you to work on the back and legs too, not because they are often neglected and never seen in the mirror, but because they will help to correct imbalances in the body and useful in a longer run. And don't do 1000 crunches a day just for the abs.

[Steve5380]

Calories deficit, calories surplus.. Is there anyway to lose fat mass while concurrently gaining muscle mass? Current fat percentage is about 14% ,trying to lose about 2-3% more to make abs more prominent, however am also hoping to build a more muscular arms/chest. Any tip or guide. Thanks in advance

 

The one sure way to gain muscle mass is to do weight lifting (resistance training).  The reduction of fat has more to do with the diet, although more muscle and overall exercise increases metabolism and reduces or reverses accumulation of fat.  The correct diet has to do with the type of food we eat, and the body lets us know, within limits, the quantity it likes to be fed.  Good eating habits (many small meals if possible equally spaced throughout the day, not close to bed time, etc) are sufficiently good care without having to rigorously count calories.

 

For gaining muscle mass it is convenient to work the lower body: squats, dead lifts, lounges, calf press, hamstring and lower back exercises, etc.  Strength in the legs is one of the nicest benefits of fitness.  We don't walk, jump with the arms but with the legs.  To lose fat to have the abs show more is no replacement for very important abs exercises, even isometric ones.  And if you can do 1000 crunches, it won't hurt to do them. Maddona has done those too, together with other more efficient abs exercises,  and she does not look bad...  (I did the 1000 crunches too for a while, but I could not look like her )

Edited October 28, 2015 by Steve5380

[xydboy]

Well, you can do 1000 abs exercise, it just shows your trunk flexion has good endurance, but it doesn't represent a good functional core movement. Lots of anti-flexion/extension/rotation,etc should be done together with lots of hip movements too. Some list exercises i took from the NSCA performance training journal (http://bretcontreras.com/wp-content/uploads/Strategies-for-Optimal-Core-Training-Program-Design.pdf) includes front planks, farmers walk, cable chops, etc. Feel free to look at the sample program in the above mentioned link. You can use the training program during your training. Pick a few to do and mix and match around. Definitely can help you shape your core better in terms of functional purpose.

[Steve5380]

Well, you can do 1000 abs exercise, it just shows your trunk flexion has good endurance, but it doesn't represent a good functional core movement. 

 

1000 crunches do more than just showing endurance of trunk flexion.  They develop endurance of the abs muscles.  There is no doubt that crunches are effective exercises. Like with other exercises, there are different opinions about the convenience to do high reps with little weight or few repetitions with heavy weight.

 

You won't do 1000 crunches in good form right away.  It takes many months to work up to this number.  If you do a mixture of straight and crossed crunches (where you touch right knee with left elbow and vice versa,  they are even more difficult to do and involve a few more muscles.

 

A good recommendation for this exercise is that Madonna chose to do it.  She can afford the best personal trainers, and they won't let her do something wrong.  And nobody says that this should be the only exercise for the abs. One good isometric one, which I have done plenty, is to lay on the back, legs stretched out, holding them lifted just barely from the floor.  Hold this for five minutes, and your abs will be so strong that you will never get a belly.

[TheKaze]

http://seannal.com/articles/training/cardio-while-bulking.php

One very recent meta-analysis conducted compared exercise (cardio vs resistance training), diet and combination of both. It was found that diet and resistance exercise was useful in the retention of fat free mass and losing fat mass (source: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4429709/pdf/40200_2015_Article_154.pdf). So do remember to include lots of resistance training exercises. I think that arms and chest are over-rated. I would advise you to work on the back and legs too, not because they are often neglected and never seen in the mirror, but because they will help to correct imbalances in the body and useful in a longer run. And don't do 1000 crunches a day just for the abs.

The one sure way to gain muscle mass is to do weight lifting (resistance training).  The reduction of fat has more to do with the diet, although more muscle and overall exercise increases metabolism and reduces or reverses accumulation of fat.  The correct diet has to do with the type of food we eat, and the body lets us know, within limits, the quantity it likes to be fed.  Good eating habits (many small meals if possible equally spaced throughout the day, not close to bed time, etc) are sufficiently good care without having to rigorously count calories.

 

For gaining muscle mass it is convenient to work the lower body: squats, dead lifts, lounges, calf press, hamstring and lower back exercises, etc.  Strength in the legs is one of the nicest benefits of fitness.  We don't walk, jump with the arms but with the legs.  To lose fat to have the abs show more is no replacement for very important abs exercises, even isometric ones.  And if you can do 1000 crunches, it won't hurt to do them. Maddona has done those too, together with other more efficient abs exercises,  and she does not look bad...  (I did the 1000 crunches too for a while, but I could not look like her )

Thanks for the insights guys

[xydboy]

1000 crunches do more than just showing endurance of trunk flexion.  They develop endurance of the abs muscles.  There is no doubt that crunches are effective exercises. Like with other exercises, there are different opinions about the convenience to do high reps with little weight or few repetitions with heavy weight.

 

You won't do 1000 crunches in good form right away.  It takes many months to work up to this number.  If you do a mixture of straight and crossed crunches (where you touch right knee with left elbow and vice versa,  they are even more difficult to do and involve a few more muscles.

 

A good recommendation for this exercise is that Madonna chose to do it.  She can afford the best personal trainers, and they won't let her do something wrong.  And nobody says that this should be the only exercise for the abs. One good isometric one, which I have done plenty, is to lay on the back, legs stretched out, holding them lifted just barely from the floor.  Hold this for five minutes, and your abs will be so strong that you will never get a belly.

So...just because Madonna chose to do it or the "best" personal trainers told her to do it, that makes it the correct way? The first underline statement that you made, when I refer the term trunk flexion, its essential the rectus abdominis because that are the big trunk flexors. So when you say that 1000 crunches do more than just showing endurance of the rectus abdominis, they develop endruance of the abs? huh?

 

Yes I agree that people don't do the exercise with good form right away. Yes isometric activation of the trunk muscles is good. But what I am saying is that the core has 3 layers (Deep layer: Rotatores, interspinali, and intertransversarii. Middle layer:

Transverse abdominis, multifidi, quadratus lumborum, posterior fibers of the internal oblique, the diaphragm, and the pelvic floor muscles and fascia. Outer layer: Rectus abdominis, erector spinae group, external and internal obliques, and iliopsoas), its more than just the rectus abdominis. And people are always talking about crunches and crunches but crunches isn't the way to do. In fact its like over-rated. There are many athletes out there with good core movement and control and they don't do 1000 crunches.

 

And for the last underlined statement, wow amazing..why not subject yourself to Sahrmanns test (http://www.spechtpt.com/popup/core_stability_test.html). Lots of people cannot perform both test well. Trunk position just gets compromised due to the wrong muscles being utilised.

Edited October 29, 2015 by xydboy

[Steve5380]

 

So...just because Madonna chose to do it or the "best" personal trainers told her to do it, that makes it the correct way? The first underline statement that you made, when I refer the term trunk flexion, its essential the rectus abdominis because that are the big trunk flexors. So when you say that 1000 crunches do more than just showing endurance of the rectus abdominis, they develop endruance of the abs? huh?

 

Yes. "Just showing endurance" sounds like something cosmetic.  The 1000 crunches actually CREATE the endurance. 

In the field of nutrition and body building there has been an explosion of "expertise" that can severely cloud the issues. This is why it is wise to follow by the example from outstanding people as much as by the studies of people with long winded titles.  When Arnold Schwarzenegger does a muscle-building exercise this can inspire some trust in the exercise.  And Madonna is amazing in the degree of fitness at her age.  So she can be a role model and the exercises she does can be equally trusted to provide a slim fit body, I think.

 

 

Yes I agree that people don't do the exercise with good form right away. Yes isometric activation of the trunk muscles is good. But what I am saying is that the core has 3 layers (Deep layer: Rotatores, interspinali, and intertransversarii. Middle layer:

--- And people are always talking about crunches and crunches but crunches isn't the way to do. In fact its like over-rated. There are many athletes out there with good core movement and control and they don't do 1000 crunches.

 

 I don't propose that everyone does 1000 crunches.  (200 may be sufficient).  What I am saying is that it is not a bad idea to do 1000 crunches if you like the challenge, and the result will be better than if you do no crunches, or 200, or 500.   Not everyone should run a marathon, but it is better than not doing it, or doing only a half-marathon.  (Contrary to marathons who can have adverse effects in some people, I never heard of any damage caused by 1000 crunches)

 

 

And for the last underlined statement, wow amazing..why not subject yourself to Sahrmanns test (http://www.spechtpt.com/popup/core_stability_test.html). Lots of people cannot perform both test well. Trunk position just gets compromised due to the wrong muscles being utilised.

 

I didn't know about a Shermanns test, but it fits well with the isometric exercise I described.  In supine position, lift your extended legs barely from the floor and hold them there.  This should be done while keeping your lower back at the waist pressed or at least in contact with the floor.  Practice this, and you pass the "Shermann test with flying colors.  Most people can only hold for some tens of seconds,  but with practice you can reach minutes, and five minutes is a good challenge like a marathon or the 1000 crunches.  These core exercises form like a firm corset under the skin.  You can check such good muscle tone while driving, by being able to stick your fingers under your belt, which should not be what holds the guts like a sack of potatoes.

[xydboy]

Yes. "Just showing endurance" sounds like something cosmetic.  The 1000 crunches actually CREATE the endurance. 

In the field of nutrition and body building there has been an explosion of "expertise" that can severely cloud the issues. This is why it is wise to follow by the example from outstanding people as much as by the studies of people with long winded titles.  When Arnold Schwarzenegger does a muscle-building exercise this can inspire some trust in the exercise.  And Madonna is amazing in the degree of fitness at her age.  So she can be a role model and the exercises she does can be equally trusted to provide a slim fit body, I think.

 

 

 

 I don't propose that everyone does 1000 crunches.  (200 may be sufficient).  What I am saying is that it is not a bad idea to do 1000 crunches if you like the challenge, and the result will be better than if you do no crunches, or 200, or 500.   Not everyone should run a marathon, but it is better than not doing it, or doing only a half-marathon.  (Contrary to marathons who can have adverse effects in some people, I never heard of any damage caused by 1000 crunches)

 

 

 

I didn't know about a Shermanns test, but it fits well with the isometric exercise I described.  In supine position, lift your extended legs barely from the floor and hold them there.  This should be done while keeping your lower back at the waist pressed or at least in contact with the floor.  Practice this, and you pass the "Shermann test with flying colors.  Most people can only hold for some tens of seconds,  but with practice you can reach minutes, and five minutes is a good challenge like a marathon or the 1000 crunches.  These core exercises form like a firm corset under the skin.  You can check such good muscle tone while driving, by being able to stick your fingers under your belt, which should not be what holds the guts like a sack of potatoes.

I believe now there is a great shift from evidence based practice, which is why many things we do are often coming from research work. Not saying that those who get great bodies can't be good role models, but we do have to validate what they do as well. Just because they get a body through whatever they have been doing, eg. eating this and that, doing this and that workout, it doesn't mean that what this person does can be re-created and repeated in other people. Its just like in the medical field, dr A can give medicine A to patient 1, but when dr B evaluates his own patient, just because this patient shows something similar to patient 1 seen by dr A, it doesn't mean he can replicate the same prescription. Its all about what evidence in research says. Yes it might seem like I'm complicating things, but that's what we need to achieve. its not a copy and paste lifestyle that we are seeking, but rather how we can get the right information to create the healthy lifestyle that suits ourselves. If I see Madonna doing 1000 crunches, I want to achieve her body, I do 1000 crunches, I might not like it or end of the day I don't get the results that I want, so does that mean that I am wrong or she is wrong?

 

As for crunches, some modifications are required for people with certain conditions. Not everyone can do crunches. As such, we just cannot simply blindly copy what the role models do. yes the role models are doing a great job in keeping their body fit. yes what they do is awesome for them, but if I do the same thing as them, it doesn't mean that I will be just like them. Yes I will be closer, but does that make things enjoyable for myself? If it is then its good if not how, what should I do and how to go about achieving what I want to achieve?

 

Its very different from an isometric test. it is a very specific test that looks at core stability. Many people after lifting the leg would end up with a pelvic tilt that compromise spinal/core stability and that is a no-no in the test. Yes the core is suppose to be a thick corset, but do note that abdominal fatness doesn't mean that the person's core isn't fantastic. Powerlifters can be rather "fat" to a certain extend, but that doesn't mean their core isn't good. Lots of things to consider when we talk about core stability and many people are very misinformed about this aspect. One possible reason is that people equate visible or strong abs with good core. Lots of aesthetic or physique competitors are ripped with nice abs but put them onto a core stability test and they fail.

[Steve5380]

I believe now there is a great shift from evidence based practice, which is why many things we do are often coming from research work. Not saying that those who get great bodies can't be good role models, but we do have to validate what they do as well. Just because they get a body through whatever they have been doing, eg. eating this and that, doing this and that workout, it doesn't mean that what this person does can be re-created and repeated in other people. Its just like in the medical field, dr A can give medicine A to patient 1, but when dr B evaluates his own patient, just because this patient shows something similar to patient 1 seen by dr A, it doesn't mean he can replicate the same prescription. Its all about what evidence in research says. Yes it might seem like I'm complicating things, but that's what we need to achieve. its not a copy and paste lifestyle that we are seeking, but rather how we can get the right information to create the healthy lifestyle that suits ourselves. If I see Madonna doing 1000 crunches, I want to achieve her body, I do 1000 crunches, I might not like it or end of the day I don't get the results that I want, so does that mean that I am wrong or she is wrong?

 

As for crunches, some modifications are required for people with certain conditions. Not everyone can do crunches. As such, we just cannot simply blindly copy what the role models do. yes the role models are doing a great job in keeping their body fit. yes what they do is awesome for them, but if I do the same thing as them, it doesn't mean that I will be just like them. Yes I will be closer, but does that make things enjoyable for myself? If it is then its good if not how, what should I do and how to go about achieving what I want to achieve?

 

Its very different from an isometric test. it is a very specific test that looks at core stability. Many people after lifting the leg would end up with a pelvic tilt that compromise spinal/core stability and that is a no-no in the test. Yes the core is suppose to be a thick corset, but do note that abdominal fatness doesn't mean that the person's core isn't fantastic. Powerlifters can be rather "fat" to a certain extend, but that doesn't mean their core isn't good. Lots of things to consider when we talk about core stability and many people are very misinformed about this aspect. One possible reason is that people equate visible or strong abs with good core. Lots of aesthetic or physique competitors are ripped with nice abs but put them onto a core stability test and they fail.

 

I was joking when I said that I did 1000 crunches so that I can look like Madonna. I was not after her looks, but after her fitness. And it was not a blind faith in her, but also my experience with crunches that I noticed to be beneficial to my abs.  It is good to communicate that what we learn by reading, but it is even better to do it with what we experience ourselves.  Madonna is just a reassurance that I am doing what is right.  And I mention her to give more weight to what I am saying.  Your reading of research about sports, exercising is valuable too, and most of the times it is correct.

 

What you say about crunches, that some modifications are required and we cannot simply copy what the role models do, applies to ALL exercises.  And it has to apply to the conclusions of "research" too, because we are all different in minor ways.  We have discussed this at length on the topics of counting calories, using the Smith rack, etc. etc.

 

A good core is somewhat independent of what is inside its muscular surrounding.  Surely the heavy powerlifters, sumo wrestlers, American football players have much mass inside that is not muscle, and if we think about it, most of our abdominal organs are soft tissues too.  So a strong core is not exclusive of the very slim, and practically every top notch athlete has a strong core.  But men with a protruding tummy usually have NOT strong cores.  So for the majority of us gay men who want to feel and look good along the years it is convenient to realize the benefit of cultivating a strong core, which can have a more practical value than only big muscles elsewhere.

[xydboy]

I was joking when I said that I did 1000 crunches so that I can look like Madonna. I was not after her looks, but after her fitness. And it was not a blind faith in her, but also my experience with crunches that I noticed to be beneficial to my abs.  It is good to communicate that what we learn by reading, but it is even better to do it with what we experience ourselves.  Madonna is just a reassurance that I am doing what is right.  And I mention her to give more weight to what I am saying.  Your reading of research about sports, exercising is valuable too, and most of the times it is correct.

 

What you say about crunches, that some modifications are required and we cannot simply copy what the role models do, applies to ALL exercises.  And it has to apply to the conclusions of "research" too, because we are all different in minor ways.  We have discussed this at length on the topics of counting calories, using the Smith rack, etc. etc.

 

A good core is somewhat independent of what is inside its muscular surrounding.  Surely the heavy powerlifters, sumo wrestlers, American football players have much mass inside that is not muscle, and if we think about it, most of our abdominal organs are soft tissues too.  So a strong core is not exclusive of the very slim, and practically every top notch athlete has a strong core.  But men with a protruding tummy usually have NOT strong cores.  So for the majority of us gay men who want to feel and look good along the years it is convenient to realize the benefit of cultivating a strong core, which can have a more practical value than only big muscles elsewhere.

Well, what could have been done early was to determine what "protruding tummy" would have been. It is with apologies if I misinterpret as sumo wrestlers also happen to have protruding tummy as well. So perhaps a better term would be greater adipose tissues at the abdominal region? I don't know..

Edited October 31, 2015 by xydboy

[Steve5380]

Well, what could have been done early was to determine what "protruding tummy" would have been. It is with apologies if I misinterpret as sumo wrestlers also happen to have protruding tummy as well. So perhaps a better term would be greater adipose tissues at the abdominal region? I don't know..

 

You are right that we don't define completely what we discuss about, and so we come to different conclusions . 

 

Sumo wrestlers probably welcome their protruding tummies that add to their weight.  We gay men despise protruding tummies, which are not always the result of added fat.  Sometimes it is the lack of muscle tone of the core.  We all can stick out the belly like we are pregnant,  but this is not the normal state.  To get this good muscle tone is an even more important reason for abs exercises than to show off a six-pack. My interest in doing 1000 crunches was to get bigger six-packs but it did not work so well, instead I got great muscle tone,  Now that I have it, I don't need so many exercises but the awareness of keeping the belly tucked in is sufficient and I will never have a protruding belly. 

[speedoluver]

i have bad posture as do not consciously tuck in my core. will doing crunches strengthen my core and improve my posture?

[CamperBoy]

Do you guys visit sports therapists or chiropractors occasionally?

[xydboy]

Do you guys visit sports therapists or chiropractors occasionally?

It doesn't come cheap per session. Depending on the severity of the condition, you might or might not need a visit. If its just some tight muscles, might just need to do your own stretching and stuff like that. If really need a massage and to correct joint or muscloskeletal issues, then yes, a visit would be required. If i have the time, I would visit my sports massage course classmate's place for a rub down. Some places i can work on my own but other places are just to inaccessible.

[CamperBoy]

It doesn't come cheap per session. Depending on the severity of the condition, you might or might not need a visit. If its just some tight muscles, might just need to do your own stretching and stuff like that. If really need a massage and to correct joint or muscloskeletal issues, then yes, a visit would be required. If i have the time, I would visit my sports massage course classmate's place for a rub down. Some places i can work on my own but other places are just to inaccessible.

Yeah. It is expensive!

But sometimes I feel that it's good to "realign" the bones. I sometimes feel that my head is not aligned with the spine lol

Side track, day 7 of my diet. Lost a bit of size. But not weight. Kinda sad. Lol

But I think the process is like that yeah.

[Steve5380]

Yeah. It is expensive!

But sometimes I feel that it's good to "realign" the bones. I sometimes feel that my head is not aligned with the spine lol

 

Must be funny to have the bones "misaligned".  Your head is not above your spine?

[Steve5380]

Do you guys visit sports therapists or chiropractors occasionally?

 

I have never visited a sports therapist or chiropractor in my life.

As a child, coming from a modest family this would have been out of reach.

As an adult, having some idea of how the body works, I have always been able to "fix" myself.

[Steve5380]

i have bad posture as do not consciously tuck in my core. will doing crunches strengthen my core and improve my posture?

 

You can strengthen your core any time, and you can do this at home.

 

1. Lay on your back, feet elevated, and do the crunches.  Or if you go to a gym, do also other exercises for the abs.

 

2. Still on your back with feet stretched out, lift them slightly from the floor and HOLD... as long as you can.  This is the isometric exercise for the abs I mentioned earlier, that gives good tone to these muscles.

 

3. Standing up, do "Stiff-legged deadlifts" (look this up on the internet), if possible with increasingly heavier weights in your hands. This is great for your lower back, the back part of your core, IF you do them with GOOD FORM (not rounding your back).

 

4. Practice a helpful mental exercise:  IMAGINE that you have around your middle section a strong CORSET very thin and flexible...   under the skin, that keeps your guts tucked in in perfect position.  Think of it while you walk, sit, drive and lay in bed (face up).  THINK YOURSELF into good posture.

 

5. If you want to further improve your health, practice the BREATH OF FIRE.  Not the video game but the movement of Kundalini yoga (look it up on the web). This breathing exclusively through the diaphragm without lifting shoulders nor moving ribs involves the muscles of the core, and you become very aware of them.

Edited November 1, 2015 by Steve5380

[xydboy]

Yeah. It is expensive!

But sometimes I feel that it's good to "realign" the bones. I sometimes feel that my head is not aligned with the spine lol

Side track, day 7 of my diet. Lost a bit of size. But not weight. Kinda sad. Lol

But I think the process is like that yeah.

Realignment of bones or whatsoever is ok. But your body is able to cope with slight misalignment. No harm having a few sessions with them, but do not expect a change after one session. 

[darkflame]

I was wondering, does stress affect your muscle building?

I tend to get stressed at the gym especially when someone is waiting for me to finish my exercise.

Or when someone gets annoyed because I'm using the gym equipment during his 'time period'.

[bluerunner]

I was wondering, does stress affect your muscle building?

I tend to get stressed at the gym especially when someone is waiting for me to finish my exercise.

Or when someone gets annoyed because I'm using the gym equipment during his 'time period'.

Perhaps you would like to consider sharing the machine with him. If it's too troublesome, then tell him to come back after sometime. Please do it let him pressurise you in anyway. Practice makes perfect.

[CamperBoy]

Must be funny to have the bones "misaligned". Your head is not above your spine?

Hahaha!

It is obviously, but sometimes the head can be "protruding" out a bit, which makes your spinal bones unaligned..

But like what someone said, sure need sessions after sessions for good results lol