How To Be A Better Top?+ What Makes A Good Top? (compiled)

[otter]

i am a flexi top, but its hard to find a good top in sauna

most of the time, people in sauna very passive. only want to be service

so what makes a good top?

[Buaya]

Well, you top too, so you should know...

A good top should

- Know what his bottom want

- Not hurt the bottom

- Let the bottom enjoy the whole penetration process

I would also think a good top should let his bottom cum while pumping him. Seriously, there are times when I really don't see the need to cum after my boy cums... If I continue, it will be painful for him as I can last a very long time...

I also believe that good tops satisfy their bottoms the way their bottoms want them to.

But there are also bottoms who secretly want their tops to 'rape' them... I have a friend who wished his boyfriend can rape him... So, I guess, it really depends on the bottom.

What would YOU like to see in your top?

[otter]

its not so much of the anal thing. its making the whole session enjoyable. may be the people i had fun with are just too passive in love making

[GachiMuchi]

IMHO (in my humble opinion), I think a top could do the following:-

In the beginning

Put aside some time to stimulate the bottom, by licking him, from head to toe, nibbling on the nape of the neck, ears, nipples, etc. Taking into account, how the bottom react, the top should do lots of foreplay, etc. to get the bottom high and in the mood for a hot session.

Before penetration

A top can initiate by applying lubricant for the bottom using finger. It can start with 1 finger then maybe 2 fingers. It will help the bottom relax his spincher muscle so as it is less painful when entering later. Using the finger, top can also try to use the finger to hit/massage the prostate so that it can add to more highten sensation.

During penetration

Do not rush into the act. Apply more lube. Go slow. See the reaction of the bottom. If he signal that it is painful, then just stay at the entrance. Top should ease the dick and let the lube help in sliding into the ass as the bottom relaxes.

Do it

Once inside, start pistoning in and out slowly. Varies you style; Slow to fast, fast then slow, deep pumping, vibrating, etc. Always observe the expression of the bottom to see if they are enjoying or suffering from your onslought. Some bottom like hard, some like it gentle, some like long session, some short, so varies your style and tailor your style so that you can enjoy and so can the bottom.

Cumming

When feeling that you are about to cum, stop moving. Try preferably, to coincide your cumming with that of the bottom. Of course, if proper communication with no selfish thoughts, both can cum together.

After the session

A top could help clean the bottom with dry/wet tissue. Then, after all cleaning are done, a good hug or showering together would be nice.

Of course, the above can varies with each situation and the time available. Hopefully, it it not like some bottom say that they are only servincing a top.

[jun|0r]

hey i wan to know why sometimes i fxxk ppl or someone suck me... i will not cum myself.. only mast then i can cum myself..

[GachiMuchi]

My Ex used to have such problem, but the problem was solved, after I started fcuking him. He was able to cum when I am inside him as he masturbates. The sensation he gets was so intense that he shakes violently while cumming.

[Guest Guest]

But there are also bottoms who secretly want their tops to 'rape' them... I have a friend who wished his boyfriend can rape him... So, I guess, it really depends on the bottom.

What would YOU like to see in your top?

These things are really very confusing to me even though I am flexi. Some btms like soft, some like hard fxxking and can tell from their responses.

But I myself is very different when I btm. Because I'm flexi, I don't automatically signal that I want to be btm. I push the fingers away from my hole, I struggle to be on top...if I think my partner is likely to be btm.

But if my partner is my cup of tea and he's likely to be top, I'll play hard to get and act like a top to make him want me so much that he'll have to almost rape me before I'll surrender You can well imagine how many men would dare to be that violent since I'm quite strong myself. That's why I get fxxked very infrequently and the few times I did are the most memorable despite the almost violence and initial pains of being penetrated by force.

Of course it's all safe violence because somehow there are enough tops who know how to play out this game. These are what I consider alpha tops. The inexperienced or clueless ones would have long given up or thought I was a pure top.

I always thought that I must be quite perverted to only like being fxxked this way till I read here that some liked it that way too Then someone explained that these alpha tops are more passionate and active when they are aroused by the right person, they give better fxxks.

Some tops think that they are all so macho and manly because they pump like energiser bunny. Oh please... what makes you think that every one wants a jackhammer in their ass? dry.gif

The truth is, this is the type of top that gives the best fxxk to me. But I'm only the minority weirdo here :whistle: The caring and soft touch never gets my engine going. Yet my preference is not considered s&m. It's rough sex but a thin hairline away from domination because humliation acts was not explicit. It's closer to rape because I don't want plain anal sex and the only way I'll be penetrated is by force.

These alpha tops are usually the stronger and more burly men. But I've being penetrated by younger men and also by matured men. The type that others here like to complain about for not taking no for an answer and being obnoxious in chasing and following you around. The truth is that there there are some who eventually give in even after saying no a few times. :whistle: Why? Unless he is butt-ugly, it's fun to see how he'll savor his hard earn trophy. You can bet he'll take revenge for being rejected earlier and enjoy seeing you still struggle and still pretending. The more you struggle the harder he fxxks. It brings out the beast in most men. The satisfaction on his face to fxxk a stuckup guy and reverse the expected roles.

This goes to show that a good top is only in the eye of the beholder/btm.

[thaiboyz]

[but if my partner is my cup of tea and he's likely to be top, I'll play hard to get and act like a top to make him want me so much that he'll have to almost rape me before I'll surrender You can well imagine how many men would dare to be that violent since I'm quite strong myself. That's why I get fxxked very infrequently and the few times I did are the most memorable despite the almost violence and initial pains of being penetrated by force.

I came across several cases when guys claimed that they were top initially when i tried to play with their ass. Some reacted quickly by pushing my hand away, but after few trys, they allowed me to finger them.From the moanings, somehow i can judge they were enjoying it. I will then make my further advancement and show them my passion, they would normally give in to me. I also encountered when my guys put up a struggle, and obviously, i could tell their struggles were so fade and pretending Imagine when i held them down on both hands, their legs were just curving upwards instead of kicking hard, and they spread their legs wide as sort of pulling me towards him. All these body language and actions, are all signals. In the midst of the session, they would beg for harder trusts... forgetting their initial claim of being tops. Thats totally alright, as long as they enjoyed with me.

Being a top, i can detect their signals and needs. I find it more challenging to engage in sexual acts with these guys than those who simply open their legs without even asking. Of course, there were also cases when i met some alpha tops. We got our answers after our initial touching, and we would simply smile and kiss each other goodbye. I have yet came across a forceful top. I believe the game takes two hands to clap, its a matter of compromising. If not, just kiss goodbye.

[Guest Guest]

Any advice on how to be a good top?

The challenge for being a top is

1. must be hard enuff to enter the bottom

2. must be able to hold out and not cum so soon

3. must continue to be hard throughout the topping

So any advice? esp being able to hold out and not cum so soon so that the bottom can enjoy the fxxk.

[GachiMuchi]

The above topic have been discussed before in the following link

http://bw2.9.forumer.com/index.php?showtopic=655&hl=

--------

We merged the 2 threads. In case people wondering what Gachi Muchi is trying to say.

Hendry Tan

BW Moderator

[GachiMuchi]

Any advice on how to be a good top?

The challenge for being a top is

1. must be hard enuff to enter the bottom

2. must be able to hold out and not cum so soon

3. must continue to be hard throughout the topping

Guest, even if you can counter the challenge of the above does not means u are a good top. It just means that you are able to be a "hard dick all thoughout the topping"

I think you must have confused gettting hard with being a good top. Lots more are involved to be a good top.

[Guest GB]

One man's top is another man's poison.

There is no definite good top for every btm. Every btm has his own preference. Some like plenty of foreplay, some like tender fxxk, some like harder and harder...

For me the good tops are the cheekopeks and the hamsuplos. Just from their eyes you can see they are sex wolves LOL They scare most people away at the saunas.

I purposely play cat and mouse game with them like letting them touch then act surprised and reserved. They get too close, I shy away....

When I finally agree to go into a room with him after so many requests, he's already so worked up, he'll literally almost rape me.

Of course this is no game for virgins or sensitive btms LOL

[chub btm]

this sounds really shiok leh...hehehehe

i like this tactics too!!

[WestAss]

some tops a bit inconsiderate..

like today, one ram my ass so hard that it was sore for a while. Usually able stand 4-5 tops in one visit. But cuz of him, only got 3 tops, have to turn a few down cuz it was S-O-R-E!

Gee.. cant they start with some gentle screwing first before ramming hard?

Sigh~

[Guest GB]

Depends on your luck lah WestAss. Remember you got sore ass, he also got sore cock lol. Should be shiok he got so much energy. Hehe some of us prefer a bit of rough. It's like his cock need your hole so much. He pump so hard then he sure need to huff and puff for breath like wild animal. I find men most sexy when they are thinking with their cocks like wild animals.

You can still go for 2 more?? Walau, you very can lol. Normally 4-5 per visit some more, where you find so many tops in one sauna lol.

[WestAss]

lol? means pay $10 (me below 21) just to find 1 top and then leave? not value for money.

><

[seekachub]

what makes a good top?

it varies with every btm la...no two person reacts the same way in sex....but could be similar though.

as long as the btm enjoys what the top do....the top will be a good top.

got such thing as good top meh?

if u ask me....i think the only thing i can think of to describe him will be to be considerate and sensitive to what the btm needs and want....that will make him a good top.

just my humble opinion...

[Guest Novice Top]

I am new top.老前辈 please share your secrets to be a good fxxker.In my history, I learn mainly from the bottom that I fxxk.

After put on condom, the cock cannot find his hole.Hit too high and the bottom keep telling me to aim lower, so malu.A bottom taught me to use my finger to feel for the hole first, then lube the hole, then guide cock in.Now very expert with hole aiming heehee.Raising buttock is something I learn from watching the experience bottom.They will put pillow below buttock to get the height just right for my cock to go in.More comfortable and hit the correct spot.

[Guest imseeker]

Novice top. LOL. I like that nick :clap:

[Guest Guest]

Try letting some other experienced top fxxk you a few times first. Then you will know how the bottom feels and which position is the most comfortable for the bottom.

Then only you will be able to fxxk good.

[mamemo]

Novice top should apprentice as bottom for the more experienced tops out there.

Then you'll know how to guide the dick into the hole better,no?

!

u do that huh?

[Guest rupert murdocking]

Actually , the top just needs to have the right size cock and able to fxxk long and control his cumming as long as the bottom wants him to.

These are the two most highlighted quality, that slut and seasoned bottoms say a good top must have otherwise they will feel it is a waste of time for them to get ready to be fxxk by a top whom they eventually found out to fail these two important criteria.

Once these two qualities are met the bottom will do all the work necessary to make the coupling of cock and ass a blissful, earth shaking, mind blowing, eye rolling, leg muscle cramping, sweat soaking DRIPPING from the back down to the balls sex experience for the top.

A top when meeting a seasoned bottom just needs to maintain his hard erection and staying power and the bottom wil use his seasoned ass muscle to milk, massage, vibrate, piston, and grabbed the tops dick and induce a tongue lashing action or a teat suckling action on the tops cock. Of course the bottom will also provide the back ground music , by appropriate moans and groans, and whimpers and slight begging to further stimulate the top, some say the seasoned bottom will use every square inch of his body to stimulate every possible erotic erogenous zone on the top so that the Top will be so satisfied whenever he thinks of sex after that , automatically he will think and want to have sex again with that wonderful fxxk with said bottom.

For seasoned top , they will always like to find new , and fresh meat to fxxk , some like to look for virgins to deflower like a dog marking its territory with urine, it will move on after marking the virgin ass, some tops love to make the bottom submit fully to his fxxking, make the bottom surrender completely. In other words , most good tops love to move and spread his seed to as many bottoms after he gets his credentials with qualifications.

In the beginning , he may be loyal to one partner who serves his needs well, catering to his every need, picking up after him, tops loved to be served like king, but once he learns his skills, the repeated bottom seems to get less and less attractive , the bottom will look more and more like a tissue paper , ready to be disposed.

This is when the top starts to justify in his mind his action to dump the bottom, He will say to himself, it is a waste to all the bottom out there if he doesn't spread his skills and pleasure giving to more of the unfulfilled virgin bottoms out there waiting to be educated with his cock. He will also justify that gays are not married so no contract to bind him. ETC, etc.

So what makes a good top, some say a good rimmer makes a good, a slow and deliberate tongue and lips and breath to worship the cleaned out ass will make most bottom quiver and moan like hell, a top that can give a good rimming and tongue lashing will make the ass warm and ready, the tongue sticking into the ass hole will moisten it a bit, str8 people love to use rimming with food like honey , ice cream, choc fudge, i don't know about gays ?? If you can't bring yourself to rim, because of mental block and quesiness, try using a vibrator or sex roy moisten with your saliva before it touches the ass. Use plenty of lube of the right kind on the ass and toy.

Although for seasoned bottoms, just a bare cock and saliva will do , they say that seasoned bottoms will self lubricate like a female in heat, how true I don't know,but for newbie bottoms all lot of lube will still not be enough if they mentally are not ready for it.

The top will insert his hardened shaft and slowly inched forward, little by little , with draw a little bit then move forward. All the while stimulating the bottoms nipples area if sensitive, of kissing the mouth and french kiss with tongue to stilmuate the other ares so that pleasure from other areas will cover the discomfort in the ass and then hey presto the whole cock goes in to the ass without the bottom knowing or having time to react or even to say "AAAhhhh".

After fully inserted it depends on the intelligence of the top to go slow, or go fast, if you want to end it fast and think of your own pleasure only then move fast and deep without caring the bottom 's pain.

If you wanna make bottom remember this encounter, then you will take your time and stimulate every area that your arm and hand can reach and caress and lick and blow hot breath evrywhere you can reach, ear , mouth, nose,neck, chest , nipples , caress the thigh, back of the knee, calf,the soles of the foot. some like to suck the toes while impaling the bottom with their cock,

If you can afford it put your partner on a sling, he will be transported to heaven and you will be free to to almost all of the above mentioned while not needing to hold on to his heavy legs,

Once you found the bottoms g spot , prod it intermittnetly with your cock moving forward, then with draw until the bottom begs you to finish up with fireworks and crashing cymbals and the bottom will scream and see stars literally because of lack of oxygen.

Finish off by kissing , if you can.

most top who are serial fxxkers will not be able to bring themselves to kiss their bottoms after the sex because there is no attachment involved.

These unlucky bottoms are like table rag after sex.

LOL.

[Phil]

Actually , the top just needs to have the right size cock and able to fxxk long and control his cumming as long as the bottom wants him to.

These are the two most highlighted quality, that slut and seasoned bottoms say a good top must have otherwise they will feel it is a waste of time for them to get ready to be fxxk by a top whom they eventually found out to fail these two important criteria.

....

Lots of good advice, congratulations!

We should always try to do like that...

[Guest fucking a loose ass]

just recount an experience. i chat and went to this bottom house. tall, manly, handsome and nice shape.

some foreplay, ripped a condom and enter him. fxxking no grip loose ass. probably kenna fisted.

it is also a lesson for me to not judge a book by its cover.

only way to fxxk this type of bottom to cum is for the top to pump fast and finish and run.

[Guest fucking a loose ass]

just recount an experience. i chat and went to this bottom house. tall, manly, handsome and nice shape.

some foreplay, ripped a condom and enter him. fxxking no grip loose ass. probably kenna fisted.

it is also a lesson for me to not judge a book by its cover.

only way to fxxk this type of bottom to cum is for the top to pump fast and finish and run.

re-read my above post. need to make clear i didn't mean to be disrespectful in that post.

just writing down my encounters to better prepare novice fxxkers for unexpected situations.

[No Frills Factory Outlet]

LOL ....

some people here should also btm to know what it is like instead of pointing at others.

[Guest btm99]

LOL ....

some people here should also btm to know what it is like instead of pointing at others.

Please lar, don't do that. It is like asking a str8 guy to be a woman for a while to understand how to fxxk a woman. U will only get a softer and less manly guy.

What we want is a mean and masculine 100% manly top. He may not really know what it is like to be fxxked until so nasty by guys like him but it's okay and worth the pain for the good fxxk. I want a top who give it to me as hard as he can and show no pity. A seasoned btm can take it all and still want more. A nasty top is very rare.

[Guest imseeker]

Please lar, don't do that. It is like asking a str8 guy to be a woman for a while to understand how to fxxk a woman. U will only get a softer and less manly guy.

What we want is a mean and masculine 100% manly top. He may not really know what it is like to be fxxked until so nasty by guys like him but it's okay and worth the pain for the good fxxk. I want a top who give it to me as hard as he can and show no pity. A seasoned btm can take it all and still want more. A nasty top is very rare.

Wait till you get anal fissures

[Guest btm99]

Wait till you get anal fissures

hey goondu, when u beat yr stick so fast and furious when cumming so many times, did it fracture? the hole is more flexible than the stick.

same thing getting fxxked fast and furious gets closer to cumming, the top must be able to keep up or the btm cannot autocumm.

[Guest mouth]

Does the top's mouth do anything when fxxking. moan, suck, lick, talk with btm

[Guest imseeker]

hey goondu, when u beat yr stick so fast and furious when cumming so many times, did it fracture? the hole is more flexible than the stick.

same thing getting fxxked fast and furious gets closer to cumming, the top must be able to keep up or the btm cannot autocumm.

Who's talking about the flexibility of the penis shaft now? Stop bringing in irrelevant comparisons!

To you it's all about the top's pleasure, isn't it?

To hell with the bottom's risk of getting anal fissures as long as the top can fxxk and get off, right?

Edited June 19, 2011 by imseeker

[acidtongue]

I think an important skill tops must have is to have a sense of rhythm. There must be a variety of long, slow, deep and gentle but firm strokes with circular motion (btms especially love it when the cockhead gets pulled out and plugged back in) and fast, strong and hard strokes that should come with lots of slapping sound effects.

The long and slow stroke works better for tops who r more well hung though. Sorry for the not so well endowned

[Guest imseeker]

I think an important skill tops must have is to have a sense of rhythm. There must be a variety of long, slow, deep and gentle but firm strokes with circular motion (btms especially love it when the cockhead gets pulled out and plugged back in) and fast, strong and hard strokes that should come with lots of slapping sound effects.

The long and slow stroke works better for tops who r more well hung though. Sorry for the not so well endowned

The expert speaks!! LOL...

[Guest Guest]

(btms especially love it when the cockhead gets pulled out and plugged back in)

You pull it all out then re-insert in. Or you stop at the edge and re-insert ?

[mango_juice]

You pull it all out then re-insert in. Or you stop at the edge and re-insert ?

When I'm using dildo I like the feeling of suddenly pulling out the whole thing and reinserting...

[subarucap]

well a good top gets better with the right btm...

my btm man has succeeded in getting me to fxxk him 3 times consecutively.

so for a top to really perform... he must meet the right btm.

[acidtongue]

You pull it all out then re-insert in. Or you stop at the edge and re-insert ?

it all depends... if the btm is ultra tight even after 10 mins or so of fxxking then obviously u shouldnt pull all the way out then re-insert. if he's more relaxed and can accommodate penetration without too much force from the top then u can pull all the way out n reinsert.

but the challenge is always to pull your cock out till its almost fully withdrawn from your btm's asshole and then ram it back in. its not just pleasurable for the btm (most btm i've fxxked go wild n squirm like they r in btm heaven when i do this) but it is really shoik for the top too, since you would be able to feel the tightest part of the ass, the entry point, around your cockhead repeatedly as u slide in and out. pulling out should be slow n sensual for both top n btm to fully enjoy the sensation of the cockhead pulling out. re-entry could be slow as well, or it could be a forceful, rough but assertive ram deep into his ass, great for btms who can take a bit of rough play (which i like :thumb: )

some ppl say size doesnt matter but fxxking deep (which of course requires a sizeable cock) can be a huge turn on for both top n btms especially experienced ones.

[Guest Guest]

Reading all d post here really make me ve an urge to try a gd top.Smehow or rather im still scare as ive neer let ppl enter me b4.

[Guest Guest]

ask acidtongue to do u a favor.

[Guest Rivrics]

This is what I do with my partner. We usually start kissing and hands should be exploring the body. Touching, nibbling the ears, neck, back of neck, lower back, buttocks, crotch etc.... then layer by layer clothings all come off starting from the top, then drop the pants.... leaving only underwear. While still kissing, slowly use your hands to explore the crotch region, only fingers sliding through the waistbands and caressing the penis and balls. I usually kiss my way down from neck, to nipples to abdomen and inhale deeply at the crotch. While both hands holding on to the waist band and pulling it down. Using my mouth to blowing a gentle wind across his crotch and he went wild. Seductively licking his balls, nibbling the balls then sucking it. Putting it in my mouth and doing a tug. Not even kissing the cock, only need to use your lips to tease the cock up and down till he shivers and then start licking the head, bit by bit and let him thrust it in the mouth. The sucking needs to create a suction in the mouth in order to make him feel covered in warm caress, while your hands are behind his buttocks grabbing and guiding him in and out. Both parties has to learn how to moan and groan in order to indicate if the person is enjoying it and wanting more. Keeping your hands busy by caressing his legs up and down, tickling his sacs, kneading his lower back, pinching his nipples and of course teasing his hole. All senses must be engaged in order for both parties to truly enjoy this experience...

Part II soon

[Guest imseeker]

ask acidtongue to do u a favor.

LOL...

[Guest Dead Fish]

Sometimes it is not only about the top performance.

Had the experience of fxxking a btm who is like a dead fish. No facial experience, no body movement, no moans. Get bored with him after a while and stop the session. Just like fxxking a dead log haha.

Think a top, your performance also depends on the btm. The more responsive the btm the more both of you will be able to enjoy the session

[tyan]

mm.. in another words. To be a good top, one must be a good bottom?

[thorzguy]

mm.. in another words. To be a good top, one must be a good bottom?

Yes, it takes 2 hands to clap. It can never be the case of only one active partner in bed, it will be so damn boring that eiher party will either give up, loses his erection, or even the btm don't feel like continuing...

[tyan]

sorry. what i mean is that to be a good top, the person must experience bottom and a good bottom himself.

[Guest tattoobear]

used to have a korean fxxk buddy, he once told me that a good top is someone who know how to respect & please his bottom. Being a good top must knows how to arouse his bottom during the session, e.g. touching/licking/sucking, and also know when to fxxk deep, fast / slow, ram hard or gentle. The combination of these will keep the bottom keeps coming back for more.

[Guest Dead Fish]

mm.. in another words. To be a good top, one must be a good bottom?

No, thats not what i mean.

What i mean is that both the top and bottom must be responsive to each other than only the sex is great. Even if the top very good and skillful, if the btm just lay there no response, no movement no sound , it will become very boring after a while

[mango_juice]

used to have a korean fxxk buddy, he once told me that a good top is someone who know how to respect & please his bottom. Being a good top must knows how to arouse his bottom during the session, e.g. touching/licking/sucking, and also know when to fxxk deep, fast / slow, ram hard or gentle. The combination of these will keep the bottom keeps coming back for more.

wow korean... is he cut? always wondered if all koreans (south) are cut

[Guest Rivrics]

Now to Part II

We would slowly move to the bed and continue kissing and using hands to explore each others body. Then me on him, slowly with one hand teasing his hole. Lube must be used to, first with one finger then 2 fingers and also feel for the prostate. While fingering my partner, I will suck on his cock and balls. After several mins of fingering, you will feel him loosening up for now it is time for the entry. Then slowly enter him and then fully and let him breathe a bit before the grinding. Momentum has to be used and your hands either holding the legs and caressing him at the same time around the feet, legs, groin area while you pound him. This is where it gets interesting. As ACIDTONGUE has mentioned you pull out slowly and you will feel the tightness of the spinchter, that is where you push it back in. Do it slowly first to see how much you can withdraw before pushing it further back in. This move usually drive them nuts and they will beg for more by moaning louder and louder , toes curling and / or guiding you. Then you can do it faster and faster for a few mins, then do slow strokes. Then faster then slower. Remember to see his expression. You can do short fast strokes and then stop and kiss in between with short slow stroke. Then pick his pelvis up and do long fast strokes and long slow strokes. When satisfied, change positions by only lifting one leg only. Then do scissors technique. Then doggy, the doggy with one leg up. You get the gist. From bed, to sofa, to floor, to bathroom, to in front of mirror, to balcony, to bathtubs, to dining table, chair, coffee table.... Keep it fun for the both of you. The when you want to cum, always let the bottom know, also when bottom wants to cum, he has to let you know.... Then the explosion of excitement! The sweat on the both of you collapsing on one another, feel the catching of breathe on both the bodies... kiss and cuddle after...

[bluesea78]

well a good top gets better with the right btm...

my btm man has succeeded in getting me to fxxk him 3 times consecutively.

so for a top to really perform... he must meet the right btm.

so what makes a gd btm? had only 2 gd anal sex..which i begged for more, 1st one was when i lost my cherry to a guy, the other was a SM buddy.. 1st one, i begged for more, the SM buddy, my legs was trembling while getting fxxk..